Mad Men

I loved the moment when the accordion player came over. It totally bracketed the moment in the series when Captain Doctor Jerkass had Joan play like a trained monkey at a dinner party.

YEAH JOAN!!!!

Okay that was a dark and scary episode and Henry Francis' Mother is something else. "here kid let me tell you dark and scary shit and then give you some sleeping pills."

Henry Francis' mom is a stone cold freak. I thought something was stirring HER desires at one point, eesh.

Is anyone else getting the vibe that Roger and Peggy may hit it at some point?

I spent the first bit with Grandma Pauline (and is it me or is it creepy for older kids to call a step grandparent Grandma? My great-grandma's husband has been there since before most of us were born so for us he's our grandfather, but if he came in when we were old enough to be introduced to him he wouldn't have been) thinking she was OK. Then OMG KILL IT WITH FIRE!

Figured it was a dream sequence very early on with Don.

LOVED Peggy this episode. From dressing like an adult (loved her dress!) to blackmailing Roger to recognizing her own prejudices just loved her.

I can't have been the only one who thought Don was going to wake up and find Megan's body?

One of the things I LOVE about this show is that so much is open to interpretation, even Don's dream. On the one hand it could have been symbolic and represented Don

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or it could have been about

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I really can't wait to see how it plays out.

I'm also wondering with Joan being a single mom in the near future if she's going to putting pressure on Roger to financially support his kid. It seems like on of themes this season has been Roger being only good for his money, and that would fit into that. But I'm also interested to see if Joan coming back to the office single will mean that they'll get together again and possibly help Roger regain his mojo.

Kiran wrote:Is anyone else getting the vibe that Roger and Peggy may hit it at some point?

Oh, ew, I didn't think of that. I hope not but they are having them interact more this season...

I have that "He Hit Me" song stuck in my head now. Great.

Sally Draper is the best. She was such the little Betty-in-training on that phone call to Don, I laughed out loud. "Maybe if I wet the bed every night they'd call me." (or something.) Ha!
I love that Joan kicked out Dr. Rapist, and I still hope he gets blown up in Vietnam. Part of me thought he was going to tell her that he was in Texas the whole time.
Roger remains painful to watch. The scene with him and Peggy was great, though, and they should have more scenes together. But not together, ew.

I hope not either.

I don't think Roger is ever going to regain his mojo. I think that's what one of the themes of this season. His time is passing him by.

I actually didn't think this episode was very good. Don killing Madchen Amick felt like a dream from the get-go -- Don is a lot of things, but likely to choke out a woman in the middle of his apartment was not one of them -- and it seemed to go on too long. I was glad to see Joan kick out Dr. Rapist, but I don't know if I think it felt very earned in this particular episode. It felt to me like they decided they didn't know what to do with this relationship so she better break it off with him -- having the accordion player show up at the dinner felt particularly on-the-nose. I thought Peggy and Dawn felt somewhat ham-fisted, as well.

That being said, I thought the Sally stuff was great and I loved the stuff with the New Copywriter (who I privately refer to as Drop Dead Diva in my head, since that's where I know him from).

All Mad Men seasons start slow for me, but I just thought this episode was kind of weak.

I actually didn't think this episode was very good.

No I agree, I thought it was super self indulgent, and just kind of random. I GET IT Weiner you wanted to do an episode about Richard Speck and use it delve into a dark fairytale theme about dark existential fears about sex and violence but did every symbolic choice have to be that obvious on the nose?

I actually liked that episode where all Don did was journal to himself like Judy Blume, so it's not like I can't swing with a plot free purely aesthetic concept to explore the characters, but this didn't feel like an exploration of anyone's character, and it told me nothing new about anyone.

I actually didn't think this episode was very good. Don killing Madchen Amick felt like a dream from the get-go -- Don is a lot of things, but likely to choke out a woman in the middle of his apartment was not one of them -- and it seemed to go on too long. I was glad to see Joan kick out Dr. Rapist, but I don't know if I think it felt very earned in this particular episode. It felt to me like they decided they didn't know what to do with this relationship so she better break it off with him -- having the accordion player show up at the dinner felt particularly on-the-nose. I thought Peggy and Dawn felt somewhat ham-fisted, as well.

I agree on all accounts. I thought it was so clearly a dream from when she showed up at his apartment. I mean I get that they wanted to show us that Don has had a lot more affairs than just what has been shown on the show but the fact that it had been six years, he was clearly not sending her any signals in the elevator, it made no sense that she would track down where he lived and barge in and seduce him, so when you get it right away it drags even more..

Also, agree about the Peggy and Dawn thing but that might be because I would never in a million years put my purse on the coffee table in the living room so seeing it sitting there before she even got up and left I knew it was going to be a MOMENT!

I kind of wished I'd been a bit more familiar with the Richard Speck case when it came up in the episode. Makes me want to do a bit of research on what else is going to go down from 1966 on.

I didn't think we were supposed to be fooled by the dream. IMO it was shot in a way that gave visual cues to the unreality of it all. I knew it was a dream as soon as Megan didn't show up at the apartment. She was so concerned about him being sick at work but she ditched him to hang out all night away from home? No. I thought the dream was a look into Don's feelings about cheating and I thought it was interesting how he was the prey in the dream, kind of like Cinderella in the pitch the new guy made.

I'll cop to not figuring out the dream until Don strangled her, but it did strike me as incredibly strange and surreal, so as a concept it worked in retrospect.

The Copywriter's reaction to those photos was really interesting. I keep wondering if he might be a child of the holocaust. (I also think of the movie "the Pawnbroker" that came out in 1964 and got into that)

That's exactly what I was thinking, Gen. Everyone seemed so callous (even though I know it was mostly that horrible human curiosity we all have) and he seemed like the only one who was uncomfortable/disgusted.

Jessica wrote:That being said, I thought the Sally stuff was great and I loved the stuff with the New Copywriter (who I privately refer to as Drop Dead Diva in my head, since that's where I know him from).

Oh my god -- it's FRED! I knew I recognized him from somewhere!!

I am loving the new copywriter. Hes really interesting to me.

gannetguts wrote: Everyone seemed so callous (even though I know it was mostly that horrible human curiosity we all have) and he seemed like the only one who was uncomfortable/disgusted.

But THEN I thought it was so fascinating that he tapped into that horrible human curiosity that they all had in his pitch to the shoe company. That description of Cinderella was very sinister. He saw how everyone (but particularly the women) were fascinated by the violence and worked that into his Cinderella pitch. I think he's very savvy.

I think he's a great new character. I love him. Also agree that he and/or his father is a Holocaust survivor. There's no way they aren't setting you up to think that.

I freaking love the running gag about how everyone is creeped out by the Francis mansion.

BreezyK wrote:

gannetguts wrote: Everyone seemed so callous (even though I know it was mostly that horrible human curiosity we all have) and he seemed like the only one who was uncomfortable/disgusted.

But THEN I thought it was so fascinating that he tapped into that horrible human curiosity that they all had in his pitch to the shoe company. That description of Cinderella was very sinister. He saw how everyone (but particularly the women) were fascinated by the violence and worked that into his Cinderella pitch. I think he's very savvy.

Yes! I think he's incredibly savvy. I really think they're setting him up to be like a male Peggy. I just remember when she said something like, oh, glad they pulled the Jackie/Marilyn commercial that time and that kind of reminded me of her.

You go Joan! Ugh, I was seriously afraid stupid Dr. Greg was going to hit her. Good for her, also, for bringing up the rape--I didn't think she'd go there, but I was happy that she did. Damn, Christina Hendricks looked even more gorgeous than usual in this episode. Loved the final shot of her in bed with her new family. If anyone can accomplish the difficult task of being a single, working mom in the 1960s, it is Joan Holloway.

I loved Roger and Peggy's interaction, and seeing just how confident Peggy has become. I'm glad we got to see more of Dawn, too. Dawn reminds me a lot of the old Peggy--the shy, good girl with strong family ties. I think Peggy recognized that too, but expressed it in the most awkward way possible.

Roger needs to stop carrying that much cash in his pockets.

Heh, I love the running gag about the creepy Francis Estate, too. Grandma Pauline, I wanted to like you ever since you called out Betty as being a crappy mother last season, but you're making that extremely difficult, what with drugging Sally and all. Oddly, my own grandmother (who was fantastic and awesome and in no way like Grandma Pauline) told me about the Richard Speck murders. I'm not sure why; I was born 15 years after they occurred--maybe there was something on TV about them and I asked? Anyway, she didn't give me details, but just told me that one of the women survived by hiding under the bed. That stuck with me as a child, and when I got older and started staying home alone, if I heard a noise I would always think "I can always hide under the bed." So yeah, I totally empathized with Sally in this one.

Don choking Andrea was clearly a dream, but it was still very, very unsettling. Even more unsettling was the cut from Andrea lying under his bed to Sally lying under the couch. Creepy.

Roger needs to stop carrying that much cash in his pockets.

I know! Or, he could, you know, LIE. "How much do you have?" "Four hund- um, I mean, twenty bucks."

Seriously, at least spread out the loot among his pockets, so he can just pull out the smaller wad and be done with it.

I thought the Don/Madchen Amick stuff was pretty bad. It wasn't convincingly real, and it was very heavy-handed.

But I LOVED Joan saying, "You were never a good man, even before we were married, and you KNOW what I'm talking about." Because it's the thing about Joan's character history that I think viewers are so uncomfortable with -- the idea that he did that to her, and Joan married him anyway. We were all like, "NO JOAN. NO." I'm glad she snapped, and it showed that she didn't forget, so while I still hate that she married him I'm glad they didn't continue playing it like that didn't happen.