Mad Men

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Re: Mad Men

Post  naughty zoot on Mon May 11, 2015 9:19 am

Of course Betty's instructions for her funeral relate only to her appearance. Kiernan Shipka was amazing tonight. The look on her face when Henry starts sobbing was so perfect.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  Genevieve on Mon May 11, 2015 10:17 am

I can't say I ENJOYED this episode but I did love it. I did think, "Well this came ten years earlier than I had anticipated." (which probably sounds macabre but when you grow up with enough relations who smoked & died from smoking related causes, you get like that.)
Betty knows what she can control, and what she can't control, and if she can't have life, she can at least have the right lipstick.

I feel that Don is on this zen journey of ridding himself of all the false things and inching closer and closer to his deeply uncomfortable truth. For all of his admissions to others about who he really is, he has never actually sat with it. That nothingness.


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Re: Mad Men

Post  naughty zoot on Mon May 11, 2015 10:21 am

Betty knows what she can control, and what she can't control, and if she can't have life, she can at least have the right lipstick.
That is an excellent point. While I was walking the dogs this morning, after posting, it occurred to me that Betty is actually being true to herself and going out on her own terms. Which is admirable in its own way.


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Re: Mad Men

Post  Genevieve on Mon May 11, 2015 11:06 am

I was thinking about end of life care, and the whole conversation about what you do when you are faced with that terminal diagnosis. There is the approach Henry wanted -which is to fight it to the bitter end, which can be so exhausting and finds a person in a hospital where they are doing all these invasive measures (though probably somewhat limited in the early 70s but still pretty harsh) and in a huge amount of pain, and likely a lot more sick, than Betty's approach. This is it. I would be delaying it a bit but the quality of life would be terrible. Let's enjoy this time without the extra pain/time in hospitals.
Neither one is bad. But it does force some choices.

And I have to hand it to her, sorting out things like what she wants to wear, what lipstick she wants, and so on, is a smart move. It means when death comes and everyone is consumed with grief, they can just point to the ready-made answers.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  mialoubug on Mon May 11, 2015 11:28 am

January Jones was stellar in this episode. I was frankly devasated watching this (it was mother's day and I lost my own mom to lung cancer four years ago. Still raw). Her practicality is something she can trust, but her response to Sally was more true than anything else. And that letter! Her voice over of Sally reading the letter was perfect; there was just the tiniest of catches in her voice under all the resignation that she had. As much as I love Peggy and her trajectory, it's Betty whom I am most fond. I will miss this show tremendously.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  blixie on Mon May 11, 2015 1:05 pm

My people actually are Nordic, so in keeping with eight years of watching I didn't feel one feeling about Betty dying, she has never done much for me alive, and doesn't do much more in death, except for how it effected Sally, Henry, and eventually Don. Sally instinctively taking her mother's place and offering what her mother has never known how to do (warm comfort w/Gene in her lap), was beautiful moment by Shipka.

I liked Don confessing to Dick's crime, and I don't know if I rightfully interpreted that one dudes confession as not merely killing the Krauts, but eating them, because I liked the contrast between the substance of the literal and figurative confessions. Don is really like a snake shedding his skin.

Yay for Pete/Trudy, I wish he'd never cheated on her in the first place, but I believe he believes he's learned his lesson. I also like to pretend that Trudy will get a job in Witchita, since Pete mentioned that she loved to "close" deals with him. Also happy to see scheming Duck one last time.

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Re: Mad Men

Post  mokey75 on Tue May 12, 2015 10:42 am

Genevieve wrote:And I have to hand it to her, sorting out things like what she wants to wear, what lipstick she wants, and so on, is a smart move. It means when death comes and everyone is consumed with grief, they can just point to the ready-made answers.

Agreed. The Betty stuff hit me particularly hard. I've never hated Betty as a character, though I've certainly hated things she's done. And I felt so badly for her being treated like a child even when learning her diagnosis, what with the doctor talking with Henry right next to her, as if she wasn't even there. So planning her funeral outfit and refusing to go through invasive treatments that would only prolong the inevitable seemed like the best - and only - way to take control. It was probably the most adult she's ever been, honestly. The scene with her and Sally was heartbreaking, as was the scene with Sally reading the letter. And I kind of wanted to punch stupid Henry Francis in his stupid face for dragging Sally into it before Betty herself was ready to tell her.

I wish I could trust that Pete would be faithful to Trudy in Wichita. I hope those two crazy kids work it out, but I have every confidence that Trudy will take care of herself and Tammy no matter what happens.

I am a little concerned that Weiner is just going to make that the last we see of Don, and the last episode will wrap up Peggy's story or something.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  Arabella on Tue May 12, 2015 9:47 pm

Bye bye, Birdie! :( It makes sense that someone major on MM would get lung cancer, but I figured it would be Don. Hopefully, he's done wandering and steps up for those kids. Henry's been the day-to-day father figure for Bobby and Gene but he's going to be a mess without Betty. I wondered if Betty had already died at the end, when we saw Sally open the letter, and we were metaphorically seeing her ascend to the Great Beyond, as she climbed that staircase.

Ending the show with a Buddy Holly song in the episode that Pete takes a job with Learjet, such a troll you are, Weiner.

Apparently, the kid who plays Gene was on Sons of Anarchy and several SoA fans have weighed in that we should be glad Gene doesn't speak. Losing his mom probably isn't going to help him become more verbose.

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Re: Mad Men

Post  Genevieve on Wed May 13, 2015 6:24 am

THIS is my favorite prediction for how the series will end. Because it is in keeping with the constant theme of, "People never change."
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Re: Mad Men

Post  mokey75 on Wed May 13, 2015 10:06 am

Well, that's certainly a better theory than Pete dies in a plane crash, or the episode opens with Betty's funeral. But I would rather see Peggy be the one to come up with that pitch as the conclusion to her story. Don's been shedding his fake identity, and I suspect he's going to end up in some quiet life somewhere in CA. The kids will probably stay with Henry - I mean, he's basically the only father Gene knows, Sally's at boarding school, and Bobby can be shipped off, too. I'm sure Henry will find some other blonde pregnant lady to creepily hit on and marry to take care of them as needed.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  naughty zoot on Wed May 13, 2015 11:05 am

Ending the show with a Buddy Holly song in the episode that Pete takes a job with Learjet, such a troll you are, Weiner.
In my mind now the series ends with Don (the father) flying back to NYC for Betty's funeral with Pete (the son*) in a Lear jet with Bert Cooper (the Holy Ghost) providing commentary as "American Pie" plays over the final scene.
* as in the son of the man who died in a small plane crash
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Re: Mad Men

Post  Genevieve on Wed May 13, 2015 11:57 am

That's pretty trippy. I would enjoy that too. I just want something that ends with the audience going, "WTF?" and me cackling.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  BrightEyes on Wed May 13, 2015 9:15 pm

Genevieve wrote:Betty knows what she can control, and what she can't control, and if she can't have life, she can at least have the right lipstick.
We could have put that on my grandmother's tombstone. I so closely associate Betty with my grandmother and Sally with my mom that this episode was bizarre and devastating to watch. My grandmother died a few years ago and my mom is only just now coming to terms with how her grief has affected her and by extension, us.

I know Betty loves her children, but she does not (and never has) loved being a mother. Her sendoff to Sally was the most expressive I think we've ever seen her with regard to her kids. I could write an essay about Betty and how men in her life have always seemed to talk over her and about her because they think it's best (from Don and her shrink to Henry and the doctor), so I'm totally on board with her taking control and going out on her own terms. Her brushing her hair and making dinner and going to class are choices that she's making because she chooses to live her own life as long as possible.

I hope that Don and Henry can work out some kind of "My Two Dads" shared custody situation with regard to the kids. Because, really, where are they going to go? Megan is gone. I don't think Betty has any siblings.

Poor Sally. I hope she doesn't go though a crisis in the eighties.

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Re: Mad Men

Post  naughty zoot on Thu May 14, 2015 5:15 pm

A sweet bit of Mad Men nostalgia
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Re: Mad Men

Post  biakbiak on Thu May 14, 2015 8:45 pm



I hope that Don and Henry can work out some kind of "My Two Dads" shared custody situation with regard to the kids. Because, really, where are they going to go? Megan is gone. I don't think Betty has any siblings.

I doubt it will be a "My Two Dads" situation, more like Henry and a nanny raising Bobby and Gene and Don occasionally calling or seeing them on a the occasional weekend if he comes back to NY and maybe once a year if he stays in California. He will call Sally more regularly but she will stay in the NE for college to be close to her brothers and see Henry more than she ever sees her dad.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  Arabella on Thu May 14, 2015 9:37 pm

BrightEyes wrote:I hope that Don and Henry can work out some kind of "My Two Dads" shared custody situation with regard to the kids. Because, really, where are they going to go? Megan is gone. I don't think Betty has any siblings.

Poor Sally. I hope she doesn't go though a crisis in the eighties.
Betty has a brother, William. He's married (or was, when he was last shown) with kids. He appeared in S2 and S3 and seemed a little resentful of Don and Betty's wealth compared to his own. She mentioned him in the letter to Sally.

AMC is marathoning the entire series up to the finale. Pete just screamed, "Hell's bells, Trudy!" and threw the chicken off the balcony.


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Re: Mad Men

Post  naughty zoot on Mon May 18, 2015 12:31 am

So a big yay! to that one part, and resigned sad but not surprised to that other part and a complete WTF to the last one.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  dionneshea on Mon May 18, 2015 12:42 am

I love that so many of you and all the people in the internet called so many parts of the ending.

I'm SO happy that Joan got her own business, and is successful, and is all things incredible that we always knew Joan was. And I'm happy she tried to get Peggy to come with her, even if Peggy decided against it.

I'm happy that they not only paid homage to the unbreakable bonds that Peggy had with Pete and Don, but in the end, had her realize she's been in love with Stan for quite some time now. Her increasingly befuddled, "What?!" was my favourite part of the whole episode.

It amuses me to no end that Roger ended up married to a crazy lady, but one who's age appropriate and lifestyle appropriate and will keep him on his toes. And I adore that he has days with Kevin and acknowledges him as his son, even if not publicly. (Honestly, I had forgotten about that until that scene.) Joan's "No, he's just a terrible person," about Greg was my second favourite part of the episode.

I love that Sally has come to an accord with both parents, and the grace and maturity she displayed tonight gives me genuine hope that her future would also end up okay. If she didn't have two younger brothers that she clearly loves, things might have turned out differently, but I think her love and concern for them will keep her on the straight and narrow.

I'm glad that the last image we got of Betty was her still looking flawless and living her life as best she could.

I'm a little conflicted about Don. I'm not sure how we're supposed to take the ending. Was Weiner implying that after his healing time in the commune, he went back and wrote one of, if not the most iconic Coca Cola commercial of all time? Was he not implying that, but simply implying that even the communal peace that Don found was something that was marketed just as Coke could be. Was it simply that Don found peace is the end? Am I missing the point entirely? (So very possible.)

All-in-all, I loved it. I loved the series, I loved the characters, and I loved the finale.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  Jordan Baker on Mon May 18, 2015 1:07 am

dionneshea wrote:I'm happy that they not only paid homage to the unbreakable bonds that Peggy had with Pete and Don, but in the end, had her realize she's been in love with Stan for quite some time now. Her increasingly befuddled, "What?!" was my favourite part of the whole episode.

I've always been a bit of a Peggy-Stan shipper, but I didn't even realize how much I wanted them to end up together until it happened. Best part of the episode.

I sincerely hope that now that Mad Men is done, Matthew Weiner gets working on a spinoff that's all about Sally.


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Re: Mad Men

Post  Arabella on Mon May 18, 2015 1:19 am

dionneshea wrote:I'm a little conflicted about Don. I'm not sure how we're supposed to take the ending. Was Weiner implying that after his healing time in the commune, he went back and wrote one of, if not the most iconic Coca Cola commercial of all time? Was he not implying that, but simply implying that even the communal peace that Don found was something that was marketed just as Coke could be. Was it simply that Don found peace is the end? Am I missing the point entirely? (So very possible.)

All-in-all, I loved it. I loved the series, I loved the characters, and I loved the finale.
Apparently, some of the people at the retreat bore resemblances to the actors in the actual ad and were even styled to look like them. I'm surprised by the speculation I've seen that Peggy came up with the campaign. It seems incredibly cynical and Don-like to use all the peace, love and yoga from his psychological breakthrough to sell soda.

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Re: Mad Men

Post  Morning Angel on Mon May 18, 2015 3:10 am

dionneshea wrote:
I'm a little conflicted about Don. I'm not sure how we're supposed to take the ending. Was Weiner implying that after his healing time in the commune, he went back and wrote one of, if not the most iconic Coca Cola commercial of all time? Was he not implying that, but simply implying that even the communal peace that Don found was something that was marketed just as Coke could be. Was it simply that Don found peace is the end? Am I missing the point entirely? (So very possible.)

All-in-all, I loved it. I loved the series, I loved the characters, and I loved the finale.

The beauty of it is that it can be read many ways, which is perfect for this kind of show.  I think it can read as Don finds some bit of inner peace, and in that peace, he rekindles his creativity and love for what he used to do.  He was always a creative person, and I think part of brain thinks in ads.  He almost can't help it and can't change that.  This show has been beating us over the head with how true change is very difficult so I think it is fitting.  Plus, his quitting advertising was yet again running away from his life, thinking he was not wanted or needed.  His going back might be an acknowledgement that NYC is home for him.  On the other hand, it could be read as if he was willing to go back to advertising, he's just back to cynically exploiting a movement and his own life to sell soda, and he really hasn't changed at all.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  The Dude on Mon May 18, 2015 7:16 am

I assume this is the last time we ever see Jon Hamm play a strait role.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  Cynara on Mon May 18, 2015 8:32 am

I loved everything about this episode. Everything. I have more thoughts but for now I will just leave you with the image of Roger swanning off in high dudgeon, naked, trailing a brocade duvet like a matador's cape. Also "Rich little bastard. [pause] He really is."

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Re: Mad Men

Post  eventide82 on Mon May 18, 2015 9:23 am

Apparently, some of the people at the retreat bore resemblances to the actors in the actual ad and were even styled to look like them.

Yeah, I spotted that - the girl with the two braids with red ribbon entwined in them in particular.

I think Don definitely came up with the campaign. I agree with Morning Angel - I think Don will never really escape or give up that creative flair. Maybe on a more personal level he will change, but I think he'll always be an ad man (or something similar).

I am SO HAPPY about Peggy & Stan. SO HAPPY.

And Sally broke my heart when she said to Bobby "Get the pan, I'll show you how to do it." She's going to become a mother figure at such a young age and that kind of breaks my heart.

Joan is going to kick ass as the head of a production company. And I'm going to miss Roger. He's a bit of a shit in so many ways, but he has a good heart, and he had some of the best one-liners in the show.

I really liked the finale. When Don first got to the commune I wondered WTF was going to happen, but I'm glad he had some moments of clarity and I'm glad all the major characters got their moments.
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Re: Mad Men

Post  naughty zoot on Mon May 18, 2015 10:09 am

The more I think about it - the Don storyline - the more I like it. There's Don with another woman he thinks he can/wants to save and this time she literally strands him in a place where there's no liqour and the most common sentence is "How does that make you feel?". Of course, that's rock bottom for Don. And of course Don ends up using whatever (temporary?) peace, serenity, enlightenment he might have found to create what might be the most cynical advertisement ever created.
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Re: Mad Men

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