Les Miserables

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  RiverThames on Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:09 am

You can't buy the soundtrack until the 29th? What the fucking fuck?

At least the Full Symphonic is on a playlist on YouTube.

Also: yeah, Eponine is whiny, but the girl got Friendzoned TO DEATH. She's earned some whining.


Last edited by RiverThames on Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  ulkis on Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:09 am

whatthedeuce wrote:I was just about to ask how the characters in the musical differ from those in the novel!

Oh, a decent amount. You definitely see a lot more of Valjean's struggle to do good.
Spoiler:
After he steals from the Bishop, he steals again from a young boy, and after THAT is when he really starts doing the whole good works shebang
. Bring Him Home is something that totally went against the grain of the book - when Valjean finds out about Marius he wishes that Marius would die. Cosette doesn't do much more in the novel but I think she's really cute and funny, she gets a couple of good lines in. Eponine is shadier too, less a martyr for love. Marius is shy and adorable but at times he a stick up his butt.

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  whatthedeuce on Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:29 am

Thanks for all that info, ulkis! I legit laughed when I read that Valjean actually wants Marius to die. I wanna know more about Shady!Eponine, dude!

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  ulkis on Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:10 am

Hee. Well, he's definitely not all, I'm going to MURDER him, but
Spoiler:
when he discovers that Cosette loves Marius it's pretty much summed as "Valjean hates this stupid punk who is going to take away the one good thing in his life" and Gavroche gives him a letter from Marius to Cosette, and Marius is basically saying "I'm gonna die on these barricades love ya!" Valjean's reaction is, "I don't even have to do anything to get this guy outta Cosette's life, he's gonna die anyway, woo hoo"

Shady Eponine - She
Spoiler:
pretty much tricks Marius into going to the barricades - Valjean and Cosette have more than one house (so Valjean has places to hide just in case the police find him) and when Marius finds the one he knows empty Eponine lies and says that Cosette and Valjean left for England, and tells him his friends are waiting for him at the barricade, and his reaction is, well, Cosette's gone, might as well go die (Marius is dramatic, haha). Eponine actually has a letter that Cosette gives her to give to Marius, but she doesn't give it to Marius until she dies. Eponine is kinda crazy. She basically wants to just die with him, basically, if I can't have him then I want us to die, so she goes to the barricades as well. But in the book she actually saves him from a bullet, and that's how she gets shot, because she wants to die before he does.


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Re: Les Miserables

Post  whatthedeuce on Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:20 am

Okay, that whole Eponine synopsis is seriously hilarious! I wish there were a musical based on her just being shady all the time to try and get with Marius.

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  ulkis on Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:24 am

I wanted to add, when I first read the book, although there's tons of detail that the musical just can't include for practicality's sake, and there are some things I wish the musical did (which actually the movie will do!), I was really impressed with how they more or less kept faithful to the plot of the book. Much shorter books have been completely gutted for their adaptations (looking at you, Wicked the musical). And there have been four English language versions of Les Mis movies that I've seen - the musical is still probably the most faithful one.

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  Wildog27 on Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:09 am

Hmmm, the more I hear about this movie, which I and Mrs. Wildog will definitely see, the more it sounds like we'll need to see it before we let our 11 year old daughter see it. I don't necessarily have a problem with her knowing about the rougher side of life and the choices some people have to make to survive, but this might be a little too much in some ways.

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  queenofdenile on Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:25 am

See, I'm weird, because I've also always liked Marius and find Eponine a trial to be endured.

Can't agree on Marius, but I'm kind of with you on Eponine. I usually find her character in the musical to be a weird interruption of the main action. "The revolution is starting! TO THE BARRICADES! But first, here's some girl in a trenchcoat who's going to sing about unrequited love for a few minutes." "On My Own" is usually naptime for me (though I do love "A Little Fall of Rain.")

The widespread hate-on for Cosette kind of perplexes me, to be honest. No one likes her because she doesn't suffer enough, so basically, she gets hate for having the future that Fantine always wanted for her.

I hope they re-do another Full Symphonic Recording one day. It's exciting to have the WHOLE SCORE available, but the only person I really like on that recording is Philip Quast. I don't love Colm Wilkinson's breathy talk-singing (yes I know I'm the only one) (though I adore his "Bring Him Home") but I still much prefer him to the guy they have on the Full Symphonic, and I haaaaaaate the Fantine and Eponine.
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  Instant Monkeys on Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:33 am

Movie schmovie -- I would like ulkis to recap the entire novel, please.

I was never an Eponine fan either, because the girl on the original soundtrack, I could not STAND her voice. It was only years later when I heard someone else singing all the songs that I was like "oh, these ARE good songs I guess." Of the two songs with the same music though I prefer "Come to Me."

I did think Cosette and Marius were a little drippy. Fantine is my favorite of the ladies.
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  queenofdenile on Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:35 am

Also - and this is not the character's fault - "On My Own" was that go-to song for every girl in my drama club in high school to audition with because omigod, it's sooooo about them and their pain and they're just like Eponine, and that made me tire of it very, very quickly.
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  Esseilte on Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:43 pm

I detest Cosette, mainly because she's such a drip. Everyone else seems to be doing things, while she's sitting there singing 'Find me now, find me here' and yet she's the one who gets the happy ending?

The frustrating part of it is that it wouldn't have taken much to fix - Cosette in the book helped Valjean with his charity work, something of that included would help. Maybe instead of 'Find me now, find me here' we could have seen her working out how she would find Marius. I've seen the occasional Cosette (Katie Hall, for example) manage to give her a bit of spirit in her conversations with Valjean, but really they don't have much to work with.

As it stands, though, she just doesn't earn her happy ending - which wouldn't be so much of a problem if she wasn't basically the only character who got one. Even Marius, who for all he's a bit of an idiot at least DID something, ends up messed up for his trouble.
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  ulkis on Thu Dec 13, 2012 5:03 pm

The widespread hate-on for Cosette kind of perplexes me, to be honest. No one likes her because she doesn't suffer enough, so basically, she gets hate for having the future that Fantine always wanted for her.


Yeah, that. Cosette's happy ending is Fantine and Valjean's happy ending, that's what both of them want more than anything. And plus, as for her suffering, I mean, her father dies right at the end so it's not like everything's perfect. She's going to be happy, but it's a bittersweet moment for her at the end of the play.

I agree it would be better if Cosette went out and tried to find him or something, but there's just no time for that in the musical. (Aren't she and Valjean doing charity work in Look Down? I thought they were, but I coulda just made that up, heh)

I like how they did A Heart Full of Love in the 25th anniversary tour - Marius was reading AHFOL off a paper nervously to her (she upstairs looking out a window) and then she comes down and takes the papers out of his hands, basically it's this "it's okay don't be nervous" moment.

Movie schmovie -- I would like ulkis to recap the entire novel, please.


thanks :) But I don't know if I could make shit about Waterloo and sewers and a whole chapter on French thieves' slang fun.


Last edited by ulkis on Thu Dec 13, 2012 5:13 pm; edited 5 times in total

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  RiverThames on Thu Dec 13, 2012 5:06 pm

Right. Cosette doesn't so much get a happy ending, but rather she represented a happy ending (of sorts) for other people.
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  queenofdenile on Thu Dec 13, 2012 5:13 pm

And it's not like her life has been a total walk in the park. She was abused and mistreated as a child.
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  ulkis on Thu Dec 13, 2012 5:15 pm

[quote="queenofdenile"]

I hope they re-do another Full Symphonic Recording one day. It's exciting to have the WHOLE SCORE available, but the only person I really like on that recording is Philip Quast. I don't love Colm Wilkinson's breathy talk-singing (yes I know I'm the only one) (though I adore his "Bring Him Home") but I still much prefer him to the guy they have on the Full Symphonic, and I haaaaaaate the Fantine and Eponine.

I like him in the Original London recording, but in every other recording, too many stops and starts and odd pauses. He can't act, imo. He's AWFUL in the Canadian Recording of Phantom, acting wise.

And it's not like her life has been a total walk in the park. She was abused and mistreated as a child.

and her mom is dead too.

I mean don't get me wrong I think musical Cosette is boring. But her life is by no means perfect.

Aside from Cosette though, if Eponine got her man it would invalidate her whole story arc. It actually breaks the cliche that the cute spunky girl next door doesn't get the guy after all. It would have been nice if she could have just lived or something at least, but Victor Hugo was just kill happy.

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  Esseilte on Thu Dec 13, 2012 5:34 pm

The Complete Symphonic recording would be wonderful if it wasn't for Kaho Shimada and Tracy Shayne. Tracy Shayne is the worst kind of Cosette - so warbly and awful. And poor Kaho Shimada was apparently wonderful in her own language, and lord knows it took work for her to learn it phonetically, but the accent is so distracting.

I hope they redo a full recording at some point, just to get a proper Eponine and pick up on some of the improved orchestrations, the originals unfortunately sound a little dated now.
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  Matinee on Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:50 pm

queenofdenile wrote:And it's not like her life has been a total walk in the park. She was abused and mistreated as a child.

Word. When people complain that she gets everything and such a happy life, I wonder if they slept through the whole child-slave part.

Also, I don't really mind Eponine, but she's a poster-child for "just open your mouth and tell the guy you like him, dummy".


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Re: Les Miserables

Post  nazlan on Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:49 am

queenofdenile wrote:Also - and this is not the character's fault - "On My Own" was that go-to song for every girl in my drama club in high school to audition with because omigod, it's sooooo about them and their pain and they're just like Eponine, and that made me tire of it very, very quickly.

I think it's safe to say there's a fair bit of projection on the part of the hardcore Team Eponine fangirls.

Which may be why I dislike her so - I was one of those drama club girls myself and you know what they say about hating about others the things you most hate about yourself...
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  RiverThames on Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:01 am

Esseilte wrote:The Complete Symphonic recording would be wonderful if it wasn't for Kaho Shimada and Tracy Shayne. Tracy Shayne is the worst kind of Cosette - so warbly and awful. And poor Kaho Shimada was apparently wonderful in her own language, and lord knows it took work for her to learn it phonetically, but the accent is so distracting.

I hope they redo a full recording at some point, just to get a proper Eponine and pick up on some of the improved orchestrations, the originals unfortunately sound a little dated now.

Re-listening, it occurred to me how pointless "Turning" is. I swear that song is only there because someone said, "You know, all those prostitutes from Act I have been sitting in the green room for, like, two hours doing nothing."
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  whatthedeuce on Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:05 am

RiverThames, I legit LOLed over here! Thankfully, I wasn't drinking anything, or it would've sprayed all over my monitor and keyboard!

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  ulkis on Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:33 pm

I believe Turning was put in there actually just for some costume changes, officially, although your theory is more fun, heh. Although really you could easily just go from the suicide, put in a "6 months later" superimposition, and go straight to "Every Day"/the confession.

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  Coneycat on Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:27 pm

I suddenly remembered finding this when I was on a kick about the 70s TV show Emergency!:

Les Paramedics

It's funnier if you're old, or into TV nostalgia. But it does provide a happy ending for Eponine!

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  swsa on Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:39 pm

RiverThames wrote:
Esseilte wrote:The Complete Symphonic recording would be wonderful if it wasn't for Kaho Shimada and Tracy Shayne. Tracy Shayne is the worst kind of Cosette - so warbly and awful. And poor Kaho Shimada was apparently wonderful in her own language, and lord knows it took work for her to learn it phonetically, but the accent is so distracting.

I hope they redo a full recording at some point, just to get a proper Eponine and pick up on some of the improved orchestrations, the originals unfortunately sound a little dated now.

Re-listening, it occurred to me how pointless "Turning" is. I swear that song is only there because someone said, "You know, all those prostitutes from Act I have been sitting in the green room for, like, two hours doing nothing."
Heee. That reminds me of Patti Lupone talking about how
Spoiler:
after Fantine died, she used to go to the bar across the street from the theater and get drunk before she had to pop back up at the very end.
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Re: Les Miserables

Post  ulkis on Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:49 pm

Coneycat wrote:I suddenly remembered finding this when I was on a kick about the 70s TV show Emergency!:

Les Paramedics

It's funnier if you're old, or into TV nostalgia. But it does provide a happy ending for Eponine!

ha, that's awesome! thanks for sharing that

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Re: Les Miserables

Post  RiverThames on Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:35 am

swsa wrote:
RiverThames wrote:
Esseilte wrote:The Complete Symphonic recording would be wonderful if it wasn't for Kaho Shimada and Tracy Shayne. Tracy Shayne is the worst kind of Cosette - so warbly and awful. And poor Kaho Shimada was apparently wonderful in her own language, and lord knows it took work for her to learn it phonetically, but the accent is so distracting.

I hope they redo a full recording at some point, just to get a proper Eponine and pick up on some of the improved orchestrations, the originals unfortunately sound a little dated now.

Re-listening, it occurred to me how pointless "Turning" is. I swear that song is only there because someone said, "You know, all those prostitutes from Act I have been sitting in the green room for, like, two hours doing nothing."
Heee. That reminds me of Patti Lupone talking about how
Spoiler:
after Fantine died, she used to go to the bar across the street from the theater and get drunk before she had to pop back up at the very end.

I knew more than one actor who were believers in the theory of, "I'm only in Act I, so I don't need to be sober for curtain call."
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Re: Les Miserables

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