Downton Abbey (US version)

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  weathergal on Mon Jan 28, 2013 1:56 am

Instant Monkeys wrote:WHAAAAAAAAAT!!!! I was not spoiled and WHAAAAAAAAT!!!!!! I had no idea the show was going to go there. ROBERT, SLEEP ON THE COUCH FOREVER YOU ASSHOLE.

That was so sad. SO SAD. I cried. EVEN THOMAS CRIED FOR GOD'S SAKE.

Also HOW ARE WE SUPPOSED TO BE WORRIED ABOUT MR. BATES AT A TIME LIKE THIS. I'm sorry he's in jail and everything BUT GOOD LORD WHO CARES.

Yeah, Thomas in tears really got to me. You know a character is well loved when even the show's resident asshole is torn up by her death.

At least from previews, it seems that Cora will make Robert be on the couch for quite a while (as it should be). One of my co-workers lost his 23 year old son unexpectedly last year, and he told me that around 80% of parents who have lost a child will end up divorced. Of course this is 1920s England so the odds are a little better on them staying married, but you never know.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Gillian on Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:17 am

Instant Monkeys wrote:Also HOW ARE WE SUPPOSED TO BE WORRIED ABOUT MR. BATES AT A TIME LIKE THIS. I'm sorry he's in jail and everything BUT GOOD LORD WHO CARES.
Right??? Jeez. Every time they cut to anything Bates-related, I was like, "Seriously??? Not now!"

I was spoiled. It was my own fault. It would have to be after THIS ONE EPISODE that I accidentally clicked on the British thread. But I guess I'm glad I was able to prepare for it, because that was horrible. God, poor Cora. And poor Branson. I really liked him in Season 1, tolerated him with spurts of annoyance in Season 2, and had come back around to liking him this season thanks to his being BFF with Matthew and feeling bad that Robert is such a dick to him all the time. But my sweet lord, Dude Who Plays Branson killed me in that death scene. He and Elizabeth McGovern both. Their sobbing and pleading was SO SAD, and the doctors just stood there being SO USELESS. Poor Sybil. I'm sorry your dad is the living worst. I'm glad you at least got to hold your baby.

Thomas crying broke me, and I liked that he and Anna got to have that moment. It was nice.

UGGGHH, Robert. His awfulness is affecting Mary, who is straight-up my favorite character. I know all this stuff about the estate being badly managed is basically just there to create conflict between Mary and Matthew, and all signs indicate that Robert truly is really bad at managing it all. Under ordinary circumstances, I would admire Mary's loyalty to her dad, even though him being in the wrong means that she is in the wrong. I get incredibly defensive/protective of my dad, and I absolutely hate even the thought of him being embarrassed or having his pride wounded, especially in front of others. My dad doesn't have a large English estate to run into the ground, but I understand the emotions driving Mary's actions, for sure. But Robert has just been so awful lately, I can't even deal with him. This is going to be so excruciating to watch if they drag it out any longer than absolutely necessary.


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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Morning Angel on Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:26 am

maxell131313 wrote: What in hell is Julian Fellowes playing at?!

Sadly, Jessica Brown-Findley wanted to leave the show, but Fellowes at least picked a death that was quite frequent for many young women. I thought it was interesting to see it explore the dangers of pregnancy and childbirth; a c-section back then was definitely a big risk. I thought it was probably the best episode of the season.
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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  maxell131313 on Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:35 am

Yeah, I'd heard JBF was leaving the show, I guess I just figured Fellowes would do something like send her back to Dublin with Branson never to be heard from again unless she wanted to make a cameo appearance or something. Death is just so...final. LOL (Unless they really want to turn it into a soap opera in which case no one ever ACTUALLY dies. They're resurrected later during Sweeps after plastic surgery and a bout of amnesia.)

I guess I'm just a bitter pill. If they wanted to show the dangers of pregnancy, Ethel was available last season, you know.
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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  inversed on Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:52 am

Holy crap, I had NO idea that was coming. It was not even HINTED at in the previews from last week! Good lord. Lord Grantham sucks at EVERYTHING.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Tabby on Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:56 am

I was completely unspoiled - I didn't even know that JBF was leaving the show - and that was brutal. The scene with Mary and Edith at their dead sister's bedside killed me. "She was the only one who thought both of us were nice people." And Thomas crying. And Violet talking with Carson, then faltering as she walked to join the rest of the family.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  mrinsouciance on Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:45 pm

I'd remained relatively spoiler-free, and I had not heard anything about this one.

Besides Robert, somebody needs to kick high-and-mighty Sir what's-his-M.D. square in the nuts. Dr. Gregson will always be awesome because of last season's epic eyeroll due to Isobel's irritating behavior.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  naughty zoot on Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:50 pm

In a different vein I thought Isobel was magnificently snide last night with her (now ex-) cook. And I can't help but wonder if things would have gone differently if she'd been at Downton during the delivery.
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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  LadyGayle on Tue Jan 29, 2013 2:43 am

Oh, lord, I cried and cried. Not cool, Downton Abbey. Not cool at all.

And I agree, Lord Grantham is the worst. How can Cora ever forgive him? I can't imagine that the show will have the rift between them permanent, but damn, that's not something you ever get over.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Evil Lincoln on Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:50 am

naughty zoot wrote:In a different vein I thought Isobel was magnificently snide last night with her (now ex-) cook.

OMG, right? I couldn't help it, I cracked up when the cook said something like she didn't want to be seen with Ethel because then people would think she was also a prostitute, and Isobel replied, "I'm sure nobody would ever think that of you." That is like a textbook example of a complisult right there.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  VodouDoll on Tue Jan 29, 2013 4:21 pm

Oh, and when she said that she'd heard Manchester had plenty of job openings for a plain cook and Isobel said, "They'll find that in you." Burn.

Slate's writeup had what I thought was a perfect summation of Robert lately: "Always wrong, never in doubt—a true profile in leadership."

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Heather on Tue Jan 29, 2013 5:44 pm

I didn't know JBF wanted to leave, so I Googled after I saw the episode, and all the UK headlines were hysterical. In every sense of the word. One of them was, "JULIAN FELLOWES HAS KILLED LADY SYBIL." Something about how accusatory that is just cracks me up. There was another one in the same vein with the subhead, "All authors are MURDERERS," about people killing off their characters. Genius.

I had figured they'd kill Sybil or Branson, just because of all the Irish rebellion stuff percolating. Now I'm wondering if Branson is going to abandon the baby at Downton to go throw himself into the cause, and/or abscond with the baby to Dublin. If Matthew has to go after them and gets his ass killed in Ireland I am going to cut someone.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Francie Nolan on Sat Feb 02, 2013 12:48 am

I've been spoiled for a while about Sybil, so I did not expect it all to affect me that much, but oh boy, that was rough. I think I still have some residual trauma I haven't worked through from the Love's Labor Lost episode of ER. Branson and Cora killed me, but I had a full on sobbing moment when Violet walked into the house. Oh God, and when Mrs. Patmore started reminiscing about Sybil learning to cook I started up all over again. And Thomas!

Mary is starting to annoy me again--Jesus, you can't just humor Edith and bury the hatchet for a minute? This whole conflict between her and Matthew over Robert feels so forced.

Robert has become insufferable. (Although a part of me didn't blame him for not trusting Dr. Clarkson--dude has been wrong a lot).

I continue to zone out for all of the Bates parts. Mumble mumble pastry crust mumble mumble Vera is evil mumble mumble cellmate is angry mumble is all I got.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  mrinsouciance on Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:22 pm

So I'm interested in getting your opinions.

1. Did Fellowes set up the whole Ethel storyline simply to get to the point of using her as a demonstration of the changing mores of society in the post-war era? Or did he stumble into it somewhere along the way? Now that we're finally getting some payoff with her story, I am finding it generally interesting.

2. Similarly, is the "Robert is a wrong-headed prick" trend this season where he was going to go all along? For me, he has went from a somewhat sympathetic, almost at times progressive character to one who is pushing back hard against the changing times in a way that seems slightly out of character. Or if not out of character, perhaps in terms of the severity of his reaction(s).

I was mildly surprised that Mary voiced support for Edith writing opinion pieces for the newspaper.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Gillian on Tue Feb 05, 2013 1:58 am

mrinsouciance wrote:Similarly, is the "Robert is a wrong-headed prick" trend this season where he was going to go all along? For me, he has went from a somewhat sympathetic, almost at times progressive character to one who is pushing back hard against the changing times in a way that seems slightly out of character. Or if not out of character, perhaps in terms of the severity of his reaction(s).
I have no idea what that guy's plan is for Robert, but he sucks so much right now. So much that I was actually annoyed that Dr. Clarkson's assertions that Sybil would have died anyway actually helped put him back on Cora's good side. It's not the fact that he made the wrong call that's so horrible. It's the reasons he made the wrong call. I mean, in the end, Branson agreed to keep Sybil at the house, too, but he took the time to listen to what both doctors were saying and agonized over what to do. Robert was just such an ass about everything. Cora was right when she said that he sided with the other guy because he had a title and a fancy office and Robert didn't want to insult Dr. Fancypants or embarrass himself by bringing in another doctor or listening to anything that doctor had to say. He ignored the doctor who has known Sybil her whole life because he wanted to save face. Even if she was going to die regardless, Robert's behavior and total disregard for everyone else's opinions that night were appalling. I'd be shunning his ass to a spare bedroom even if Sybil had survived.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  dionneshea on Mon Feb 11, 2013 5:04 am

I've become a huge fan of the Matthew-Tom bromance. I love them working together and how protective they are of each other. Love it. And I do like how the family is becoming accustomed to, and dare I say fond of, their Irish rebel. And similarly, I love how Tom laid the law down with his brother about not snubbing Cora.

This Edith storyline can't be heading anywhere good. Poor Edith. Why can't they just hook her up with a nice, normal, unattached guy her own age? Is it really that hard? Or let her be the career woman, breaking barriers. Not just moving from inappropriate guy to inappropriate guy.

And I like how the Thomas storyline resolved and that he used "her ladyship's soap" as his get out of jail free card, but I can't help but wonder what this means he's going to be like next season. Will have he become kinder and gentler, recognizing some truths in Bates suggestion that people would like him more if he tried being nicer, or if he's going to be even more of a dick, angered by what happened, and bolstered by his new position? It really could go either way.

I'm also super-glad that the whole Bates thing is over. It was so boring and grim.
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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  inversed on Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:50 am

Oh my god, last night was excruciating. Poor Thomas! What kind of world is it where I feel sorry for Thomas and am mad at Carson?? I'm glad Mrs. Hughes and Robert (finally!) were decent about it. I really, really thought Thomas was going to kill himself (which is I'm sure what Fellowes wanted us to think).

I really want things to work out with Edith and the editor, but I'm dubious. I mean, nice story, Mr. Rochester, but I hope Edith is smart enough to check it out. She is a journalist now!

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  mrinsouciance on Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:03 pm

Now that Ethel is off to re-start her life, will chef wannabe Alfred be Isobel's new cook? I have to think he'd be better at that than as a footman.

Poor Moseley. He's such a drip, but a loveable drip nonetheless.

I loved how for Carson the ultimate insult would be to call him a liberal.

I think Thomas will try to be nicer, but most folks won't respond well to it because, well, it's Thomas. Then he'll become embittered and we'll go back to angry conniving Thomas once again. I wouldn't want to be O'Brian, now that he'll be above her in the pecking order.

The highlight for me was learning a new word: "squiffy!"

This season has made Robert an insufferable jerk (loved the reference to Charles Ponzi, heh-heh) but it's also made Mrs. Hughes completely awesome.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  mokey75 on Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:05 pm

inversed wrote:I really want things to work out with Edith and the editor, but I'm dubious. I mean, nice story, Mr. Rochester, but I hope Edith is smart enough to check it out. She is a journalist now!

"Nice story, Mr. Rochester," just made me laugh out loud at my desk. So thanks a lot, heh.
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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  puddingcup on Mon Feb 11, 2013 5:52 pm

I thought DA got waaaay worse in S2, but in the last few episodes, it's really getting a lot better for me. Nice Mr. Rochester line. Alfred as the new cook for Isobel is a great idea!

My opinion of Branson is veering all over the place. He was so annoying with Sybil, and he was the worst when he abandoned her pregnant in Ireland. But it was so heartbreaking for him when she died, and now he's getting so much more likable. He makes a much better duo with Matthew than he ever did with Sybil. Having him manage the estate is kind of a stretch for him, considering his experience, but a good way to keep him near the family, I guess. Thomas as underbutler is even more of a stretch. I felt bad for him, and he should get a good reference, but promoting him? That's weird.

It's hilarious how Tom & Lorenzo are calling cousin Rose "Cousin Oliver". She's only just joined, but she is not cute and super irritating.

I felt so bad for Ethel when Mrs. Bryant (?) said that they would have to make up a story as to who she was when she saw her son, and Ethel was all, "oooh,i'vealreadythoughtitthroughi'mhisoldnanny!" Obviously she had been dreaming of the situation for a while, and how she might make it work. But has she been away from her son long enough that he would have already forgotten her? Hasn't it been less than a year?

And in S1, wasn't Mary embarrassed because her parents slept in the same bedroom (not elegant enough), but now she's doing the same with Matthew? Is it different because Matthew isn't the head of the house? I don't know these things.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Tabby on Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:29 pm

And in S1, wasn't Mary embarrassed because her parents slept in the same bedroom (not elegant enough), but now she's doing the same with Matthew? Is it different because Matthew isn't the head of the house? I don't know these things.
She was embarrassed about her parents because they didn't need to sleep together any more for the baby-making. They're sleeping together because they like it, and they're all old and stuff. Ewww!

Mary and Matthew have to sleep together so that they can create an heir, for the good of Downton Abbey. And England.
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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Fraoch on Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:25 pm

Call me dense, but any idea what sort of procedure Mary had to fix her baby-making problems? Everything was so vague, especially after the specifics we heard re: Sybil's condition.

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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  bookworm on Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:55 pm

I'm thinking ovarian cyst.
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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Genevieve on Tue Feb 12, 2013 11:18 am

This Edith storyline can't be heading anywhere good. Poor Edith. Why can't they just hook her up with a nice, normal, unattached guy her own age? Is it really that hard? Or let her be the career woman, breaking barriers. Not just moving from inappropriate guy to inappropriate guy.

That is the thing though, there weren't a lot of nice normal unattached guys around. There was a surplus of something like 4 million women in Britain just after the war. Even the crippled men could afford to be picky. Yes we think Edith is lovely looking and she had some money but she wasn't wealthy enough to have the edge.
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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

Post  Carrie Ann on Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:06 pm

A sign this show has improved this season is that last night I was rooting hardest for four of my formerly-least-favorite characters: Ethel, Edith, Tom, and Thomas. It's a result of good character growth, and good writing. I still don't care much about Ethel, so now that she has the happiest ending she could hope for, I hope we're done with that story. I was so disappointed when Edith's editor was married, and still disappointed now that we know (?) he can't get divorced. I just want her to be happy.

I had to look away for Thomas's botched seduction of Jimmy. Honestly, what Thomas did to O'Brien paled in comparison to this. But in the aftermath, it was nice to see Robert James-Collier play the dramatic scenes again. I forgot how good he was in that too-brief storyline with the blinded officer last year. (Also, I enjoyed seeing him in just an undershirt.) And while the discussion of homosexuality was a bit on-the-nose, it is also important and interesting to know how gay people were viewed and treated less than 100 years ago. I do wonder how accurate some of the views expressed are though - did people really believe that being gay was not a choice back then, for example?

Lastly, Branson. The last three episodes have completely turned me around on him. Allen Leech has surprised me with his ability to play more than one note (angry political), and I've loved seeing his relationships with the other Crawleys develop. Maybe that was the problem previously - he really didn't interact with anyone besides Sybil (who is not the best scene partner), unless he was spewing some political garbage. I like seeing him grow up.
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Re: Downton Abbey (US version)

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