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Girls (and in the bathroom)

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eventide82
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Post  blixie Thu Apr 26, 2012 3:41 pm

As was the final overhead shot of Hannah's pap, where the director made sure whatever was wrapping her lower half was cracked and open RIGHT where the doctor's hand was putting the swab in, as if we were an inch away from seeing actual labia.

And the director is...Lena Dunham. Heh.

I don't think I ever heard this much about Bored to Death--I remember being surprised it was still on at one point--and there weren't clips of any characters claiming to be a generation's voice in the ads).

No that's true, but I tend to think Girls has more in common with that show than it does with SATC, and regardless I think the lack of commentary about it's whiteness is still interesting, and I include myself in that. I think for me the big thing is Bored to Death like AD, or say It's Always Sunny In Philadelphia, those shows are in the realm of Farce or Satire and it never felt like they were making claims towards authenticity/reality the way the marketing for this show is, all 'for us, by us". So it feels even more jarring to see the setting so divorced from even an insular reality such as Dunham claims to come from.

I did find the second episode much better and more of the jokes worked for, I thought the sex Marnie was having was pretty damn funny, and the HIV jokes w/Hannah were capturing the right dark, funny, poignant vibe she's aiming for. It spoke to the fact she knows her problems are illegitimate and almost entirely self-created.

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Post  VodouDoll Mon Apr 30, 2012 9:45 am

Okay, so now I've given this show three episodes. After last night, I had three big reactions:

1. When Hannah's boyfriend said that he couldn't have given her HPV because he'd been tested for it and doesn't have it, my husband and I both yelled at the screen (husband was in another room, even), "YOU CAN'T TEST MEN FOR HPV!" We yelled it at the TV many more times before the ep was over. Considering Hannah's obsessive google habit and paranoia of STIs, and also the fact that they're adult women in 2012, how is it possible that none of these characters knew that?

2. Putting myself in Marnie's shoes: if I met a man for the first time, told him I wasn't interested in kissing him, and he replied the way that guy did, "The first time I fuck you it will probably scare you," my stranger danger would kick into overdrive. At best, the guy is a presumptuous creep. I asked my husband, "Is that the kind of thing a guy would say to someone he's just met, thinking it's hot?" and he said, "No, it's the kind of thing a guy would never say to someone he's just met because, rightly, he'd be afraid she would think he's a rapist." Marnie, however, did think a stranger she'd just told she didn't want to kiss swearing he would have scary sex with her one day was hot. Um. Okay.

3. I was struck over and over, but especially with Hannah's scenes at the bar with her ex and Marnie's scenes at the party, that none of these women are charming. They're not witty or clever, and none of them have anything interesting to talk about. There just doesn't seem to be much going on upstairs. But worse than that, none of the characters (except Marnie's boyfriend and maybe Shoshana, we haven't seen enough of her yet to tell) are kind. They're thoughtless. They say rude, awful things to other people without giving a crap whether it will hurt their listener, or even making an attempt at tact. I did laugh a couple times last night, but I don't know if I really want to commit to watching a show about mean, boring people in awkward situations.

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Post  blixie Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:19 am

Considering Hannah's obsessive google habit and paranoia of STIs, and also the fact that they're adult women in 2012, how is it possible that none of these characters knew that?

I can actually buy this as part of her neuroses, despite her paranoia I got the sense this is the first time she has actually bothered being tested, so I think like the way she explained the AIDS thing last week, it's less of a anxiety that she might have something and more a "fantasy" that she is trying to maintain. Actual facts and information would disrupt the fantasy element.

Also Marnie is crazy, her boyfriend looked really cute with his buzz cut, and in what universe is that pretentious midget more "manly" than...anyone.

I will probably stick with this despite the fact I think it is not particularly funny. The confrontation with her gay ex was fairly humorous (I particularly liked "the scarf is not helping the situation"), though not in LOL way, but I think the final scene of the girlfriends dancing their day away was a really nice, genuine moment, and I do appreciate that all the girls bodies feel realistically/normative, rather than Hollywood ridiculous. I think when I started to view this as more seriocomedy than straight up comedy it worked better.

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Post  sagitare Mon Apr 30, 2012 4:14 pm

blixie wrote: I do appreciate that all the girls bodies feel realistically/normative, rather than Hollywood ridiculous.
This was the only part of the show I did like. The rest of it - characters, writing, situations - I just found tedious. As a friend said, when you find yourself relating more to the parents in the first episode than the characters, perhaps this isn't the show for you.
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Post  Heather Mon Apr 30, 2012 4:20 pm

I thought this was better than the other two episodes -- I liked the scene with the Baggage game show, and the last shot of them dancing and then Hannah abruptly hugging Marnie.

For Hannah, my suspicion is that she so badly wants to believe her boyfriend is a good person that she was willing to accept his bald testing lie at face value. But it's very frustrating to watch someone demean themselves just to see a spark of approval in someone else's eyes, so I really hope they get rid of that boyfriend character soon. I can hang with her having self-esteem issues and psychological drama and whatnot, but after a while, when characters can't or don't decide they deserve better, I get compassion fatigue.

I thought Marnie's story was pretty realistic, actually. That guy is a freaky jerk, but she's never been freaked out by a jerk, and so he represented everything that her boyfriend -- who doesn't turn her on -- ISN'T doing.

I really don't care about Jessa. But I do love James LeGros in just about everything -- he always makes me laugh even when the lines he's given aren't overtly funny; there's just something smart about the way he brings funny to his parts.

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Post  Luciano Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:25 pm

Heather wrote:I really hope they get rid of that boyfriend character soon. I can hang with her having self-esteem issues and psychological drama and whatnot, but after a while, when characters can't or don't decide they deserve better, I get compassion fatigue.

Me too. To add to all that, he's just painful to look at. He reminds me of grown-up, creepier Milhouse.

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Post  truecrystal Mon Apr 30, 2012 8:03 pm

I was struck over and over, but especially with Hannah's scenes at the bar with her ex and Marnie's scenes at the party, that none of these women are charming. They're not witty or clever, and none of them have anything interesting to talk about. There just doesn't seem to be much going on upstairs. But worse than that, none of the characters (except Marnie's boyfriend and maybe Shoshana, we haven't seen enough of her yet to tell) are kind. They're thoughtless. They say rude, awful things to other people without giving a crap whether it will hurt their listener, or even making an attempt at tact. I did laugh a couple times last night, but I don't know if I really want to commit to watching a show about mean, boring people in awkward situations.

I agree. For the first couple of episodes I kept thinking I couldn't relate because I'm 41, grew up and still live in the south and had to pay for college myself so these experiences just don't jibe for me. But then again, I didn't crash land on a desert island either and I could find something relatable about those characters. But then again again, I could *see* the comedy in this episode, probably moreso than the other two but I still don't think it's worth a laugh because, yeah, these girls are wholly uninteresting. I mean, I wasn't exactly winning any charm or deep thought contests in my early and mid-twenties either, but nobody was filming my life and calling it entertainment. The end dance scene was themost entertaining and emotionally honest thing that's happened on the show in 3 episodes to me, but I was bored out of my mind with the rest. Poor show, because it really does try so hard and yet I could not possibly care any less.

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Post  punkysdilemma Tue May 01, 2012 1:51 am

But are we *supposed* to relate to them? I've been liking the show because all of them are so naive and earnest and simultaneously kind of awful.
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Post  Genevieve Tue May 01, 2012 1:59 am

Maybe not relate but a good mark of story-telling is if you can find something sympathetic about a character even if you don't relate. You may not always like them but you see/understand why they may make certain choices. I sort of hate that I feel old at 32 and I am thinking, "WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU???" Then I find myself thinking, "well look at the job your parents did. No wonder..." And I am yet another parent judging another parent. And I really hate myself. And I have a cookie.
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Post  queenofdenile Tue May 01, 2012 9:10 am

I did feel bad for Hannah during her conversation with her gay ex Andrew Rannells (who apparently turned it off when they were in college.) And so far Shoshanna's extreme awkwardness is endearing her to me - she's annoying, but in a way that makes me feel for her rather than want to shake her. But I don't like Marnie at all and Jessa bores me, so right now the characters are batting 1.5 out of 4. Seriously, Marnie, you're more attracted to the guy from The Lonely Island than to adorable Charlie? Different strokes, I guess.

I'm liking pieces and parts of episodes more than entire episodes right now, such as the brief convo between Charlie and Hannah when she called him "American History X" and he sarcastically told her to tweet that. I'm interested enough to keep watching for awhile, but I don't know how long I can stick it out when I don't like most of the people in it, even if not liking them is the point.
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Post  blixie Tue May 01, 2012 11:07 am

But are we *supposed* to relate to them?

Yes, absolutely, and the press, reviews, and marketing (for us, by us) has been fairly unambiguous about that. I won't say it's a failure because clearly the target audience is not 40+ women, but I think a target audience of 20 something upper middle class hipster white chicks from Brooklyn is so narrow I'm not sure why HBO thought it would speak to a large audience much less "a generation".

'm liking pieces and parts of episodes more than entire episodes right now, such as the brief convo between Charlie and Hannah when she called him "American History X" and he sarcastically told her to tweet that.

And thus is another big problem with Girls in that my favorite character is a boy: Charlie. He is not only kind and cute, but he is *actually* funny. I think I would like a show where Hannah and Charlie end up dating after Marnie dumps him, except that I'm not sure I would wish Hannah on poor Charlie.

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Post  Heather Tue May 01, 2012 4:17 pm

Yeah, I agree with the idea that I enjoy kernels here and there but not the actual show. And I can relate to being lost and confused, but not to asking my parents for $1100 a month for two years, nor stealing money they left for housekeeping. But it is a tricky thing to try and make people relate to a show by acting like, "Hey, remember when YOU were this much of a self-centered clueless ass," or, "Hey, you ARE CURRENTLY a self-centered clueless ass, just like them!"

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Post  queenofdenile Mon May 07, 2012 9:22 pm

OK this latest episode is making me like the show more. I still don't give two shits about Jessa, but oh, poor awkward Shoshana, and the show captured the hipster Williamsburg band, bar, and reaction to the band/bar PER-FECT-LY. And Marnie being madder at Hannah for writing that stuff in her diary, than at her boyfriend and asshole boyfriend's friend sharing it with the world, is so unfair but very realistic.
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Post  mokey75 Tue May 08, 2012 10:16 am

queenofdenile wrote: I still don't give two shits about Jessa,
I think the only reason I don't entirely despise Hannah is because Jessa exists. My god, why would anyone willingly spend time with someone like that?
I'm meh on this show overall, but that bar scene and the Hannah's Diary song was a thing of beauty.
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Post  queenofdenile Tue May 08, 2012 10:33 am

Huh? When have Jessa and Hannah even shared a scene together without the other two? All she does is wear pants with ugly prints and complain about having to go to work every day. (Jobs, how do they work?
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Post  mokey75 Tue May 08, 2012 10:55 am

Sorry, I meant that I hate Jessa more than I hate Hannah, and that I would probably hate Hannah a lot more if Jessa wasn't there to focus my hate on.
And sweet baby jeebus, those pants Jessa wore while babysitting were the ugliest effing pants ever.
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Post  queenofdenile Tue May 08, 2012 11:05 am

OH I get it. And I agree. She's insufferable. I know that's the point but I don't enjoy watching her at all.
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Post  blixie Tue May 08, 2012 11:48 am

Ugh, I think this episode did me in, I still love Charlie and hope the adorable funny actor gets other work, but I can NOT even with these particular girls anymore.

I think maybe I'm too old for this shit because when Hannah said Adam was "charming" I nearly kicked the tv. No, no Lena, Adam is NOT charming, there is an utter lack of charm about anything that Adam does or says, it's okay to admit a guy being cocky and arrogant and mean to you turns you on, THAT I can hang with but don't pretend he's present or likable or hot. Also that is telling not showing, so stop it.

Having said that weirdly Jessa has become the most tolerable to me, I feel like at least Jessa owns what she is, a rich bitch slacker cliche. I see her as someone who keeps trying to fail or have an authentic life and no one will let her fail, the couple keeps making excuses for her and every body does it because she's cool/pretty, not because she's good at anything. I don't admire or relate to her per se, but her and Shoshanna are the least grating of the four, at the moment.


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Post  Luciano Tue May 08, 2012 6:47 pm

The only one in the bunch that I like is Shoshanna, although Jessa had me for a short second with her response to Shoshanna's question of whether Jessa would have sex with her: "Oh, Shosh, if I had a cock, it's all I'd do."

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Post  mokey75 Tue May 15, 2012 10:49 am

This latest episode had to be the most bizarre half hour of television. Was Hannah dropped on her head as a child? Why they hell would you proposition your boss like that? I assume they're trying to make her character socially awkward, but she comes across as an emotionally stunted lunatic 90% of the time. And that last scene with Millhouse (I can't unsee that now, Luciano) was just ridiculous.

Maybe I'm just too damn old for this shit, because I don't really want to re-live every awkward second of my 20s again. I hope Charlie finds an awesome girl who doesn't have psycho, annoying friends.
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Post  queenofdenile Tue May 15, 2012 1:41 pm

Every scene with Hannah in it was in competition for the dumbest thing I've seen on TV. And this "realistic," "innovative" show relies on one of the biggest rom-com cliches ever, having two characters explicitly say that they're NOT going to have sex, cutting immediately to a scene where they're tearing each other's clothes off. Poor Shoshana, having to witness this, having to be friends with these people.
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Post  puddingcup Mon Jan 07, 2013 1:33 pm

I don't know if this is the right place for this, but I didn't think that Lena Dunham needed an entire thread for herself. Anyway, I haven't seen Girls, but I've seen Tiny Furniture, and heard about her book deal, but just found this article and it is hilarious (Gawker quotes and comments on Lena's book proposal). I don't get why Lena is a big deal, and maybe I should try watching Girls, but it looks like more of the same whiny stuff.

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Post  swsa Mon Jan 07, 2013 5:45 pm

I kind of hate how much I like Girls. I'm completely addicted despite not being able to disagree with any of the criticisms of it or even liking any of the characters.

I think my relationship with this show is much like Hannah's relationship with Adam. It's so obnoxious and insulting, and yet...
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Post  spidey_88 Mon Jan 07, 2013 8:37 pm

I have not seen Girls but I suffered through most of Tiny Furniture and I wanted to smack Lena Dunham the entire time. I do not relate to this AT. ALL.

Why is "super awkward" a thing now? It just doesn't seem entertaining without heart and there isn't enough heart to make me care.
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Post  killershrew Mon Jan 07, 2013 10:07 pm

I just wanted to pop in and say that only now did I get the Beastie Boys reference, and HA!
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