The Walking Dead

I've thought Carol was nothing but a mass of fan fulfillment cliches for the past 2 seasons, so I have zero faith that any of her actions will serve any purpose beyond showing how badass and amazing she is. I doubt any of her subterfuge backfires on her, and most likely she'll end up being right in the end.

I agree that the Darryl/Aaron scenes were great. I hope Aaron isn't marked for death, because I like their dynamic and it'd be interesting to see him bring Darryl out of his shell more.

...DAMN, Carol.

Man, I love Carol. I am beginning to think Rick was right, except the only kids she is safe around ARE his. Will her threatening the kid backfire? Probably. But really, what else could she have done when caught stealing guns redhanded? I was genuinely afraid she was going to kill him. Threatening was dumber but more...sane. She could have killed him by tossing him out the window; moved the body next to the fence; snuck back to the group and played dumb to everyone.

I am also completely okay with potential sources of internal, non-zombie (also non-governor, as I unabashedly HATED all plot lines connected to him) conflict. The show was so much better to me when Shane was around stirring shit up. So, the potential conflict of Carol (rather than Lizzie) being the one who can't be around people, Rick horndogging after Jessie, and Daryl making other friends...sign me up.

I saw a post on Reddit that said "When the Boogeyman goes to bed, he checks his closet for Carol." Hee.

Binky wrote:Man, I love Carol. I am beginning to think Rick was right, except the only kids she is safe around ARE his. Will her threatening the kid backfire? Probably. But really, what else could she have done when caught stealing guns redhanded? I was genuinely afraid she was going to kill him. Threatening was dumber but more...sane. She could have killed him by tossing him out the window; moved the body next to the fence; snuck back to the group and played dumb to everyone.

I am also completely okay with potential sources of internal, non-zombie (also non-governor, as I unabashedly HATED all plot lines connected to him) conflict. The show was so much better to me when Shane was around stirring shit up. So, the potential conflict of Carol (rather than Lizzie) being the one who can't be around people, Rick horndogging after Jessie, and Daryl making other friends...sign me up.

I know. They've been flirting with that idea for awhile, that our guys ARE the bad guys a lot of the time (orange backpack hitchhiker anyone?), and I'm looking forward to the schism that's coming between the members of the group that were ALMOST out there too long, and the ones that HAVE been out there too long.

It makes sense to me that Carol would swing from one extreme to another, since she spent so much of her life being abused. She wouldn't want to have any weakness or vulnerability at all, and in this world, that's manifesting in her threatening small children with their deaths. I absolutely think it's going to blow up in her face. The question is, who will back her up? I thought it was telling that Rick called her "one of my best friends" to Sam, whereas Daryl was the one rejecting her at the end.

However, I don't believe that Daryl would side with a new group over his family (unless it takes a hell of a lot longer than I think it will). Daryl made a metaphor of Buttons the Horse; he doesn't want to be domesticated because he's afraid he's going to become vulnerable and die.

BrightEyes wrote:

Binky wrote:Man, I love Carol. I am beginning to think Rick was right, except the only kids she is safe around ARE his. Will her threatening the kid backfire? Probably. But really, what else could she have done when caught stealing guns redhanded? I was genuinely afraid she was going to kill him. Threatening was dumber but more...sane. She could have killed him by tossing him out the window; moved the body next to the fence; snuck back to the group and played dumb to everyone.

I am also completely okay with potential sources of internal, non-zombie (also non-governor, as I unabashedly HATED all plot lines connected to him) conflict. The show was so much better to me when Shane was around stirring shit up. So, the potential conflict of Carol (rather than Lizzie) being the one who can't be around people, Rick horndogging after Jessie, and Daryl making other friends...sign me up.

I know. They've been flirting with that idea for awhile, that our guys ARE the bad guys a lot of the time (orange backpack hitchhiker anyone?), and I'm looking forward to the schism that's coming between the members of the group that were ALMOST out there too long, and the ones that HAVE been out there too long.

It makes sense to me that Carol would swing from one extreme to another, since she spent so much of her life being abused. She wouldn't want to have any weakness or vulnerability at all, and in this world, that's manifesting in her threatening small children with their deaths. I absolutely think it's going to blow up in her face. The question is, who will back her up? I thought it was telling that Rick called her "one of my best friends" to Sam, whereas Daryl was the one rejecting her at the end.

However, I don't believe that Daryl would side with a new group over his family (unless it takes a hell of a lot longer than I think it will). Daryl made a metaphor of Buttons the Horse; he doesn't want to be domesticated because he's afraid he's going to become vulnerable and die.

Oh, man, orange backpack hitchhiker still kills me whenever I happen to catch that episode. (And it is one of my favourite episodes.) Until recently I thought it was the worst thing Team Family ever did.

A year ago, I would absolutely agree that there's no way that Daryl would ever side with anyone over his family. But a year ago, he was also still blindly just doing whatever his family asked him (or told him) to do even if you could tell he disagreed with it. He's started to push back, and flat out disagree with them when he doesn't think something is right. It's kind of like Carol said, before the prison fell he was still a kid in many ways, but he's become a man. However (because I can argue circles even around myself), the fact that him disagreeing with Rick's plan in Atlanta and siding against him with Tyreese lead to Beth's death may be what prevents him from doing so again.

And even though he pointed out the domestication of the horse is what lead to its death, after that he was fed and cared for by Aaron and Eric, so I'm not sure how much that lesson stuck.

I loved Carol threatening the kid, in that it seemed to me like an origin story for a fairy tale for the new zombie apocalypse world. In the fairy tales we know the villains aren't the wild animals in the woods who will eat you. It's the people who abandoned you to the wild animals in the woods.

I'm a little meh about this episode. But I don't know why.

Noah's death? HORRIFYING. Like, maybe the worst thing they've done so far. But I got spoiled on it earlier in the week (Tumblr is the effing worst) so I knew it was coming. And while I liked Noah, I didn't feel a connection to him like I did Tyreese and Beth, and even Bob. I felt worse for what Glenn was going through, though perhaps that was the point. And Steven Yeun pointed out on Talking Dead that it's the first time Glenn lost someone when he was in charge before, and so it was that much more guilt on him. (I was thinking about it, and they did lose Zach when he was there, but that was really more Daryl's loss than Glenn's.)

Aiden's death? Well, saw that coming from a mile away. I'm just surprised Nicholas didn't go out with him.

I'm glad Eugene finally got it together, even just a little bit. And it does make sense that it was Tara being in danger that got him to do it.

I'm unclear of what they're going for in Carol's storyline. It's like they took her terrifying tactic from last week and made it into Funny Hijinks. Like, the kid isn't terrified of her threats, he just wants the cookies, isn't that funny! But no, not funny, because he's being abused by his father, and now she wants Rick to murder the father. I'm not saying that Pete doesn't need a good murdering, but I'm a little at sea with how they've brought about the whole thing. It seemed forced, for lack of a better word.

And Father Gabriel. The only reason why I wasn't totally concerned during that scene is that he's so CLEARLY gone off the deep end, I don't know if Deanna even takes him seriously. Which is as it should be.

I agree completely the Carol bit with the kid - it doesn't seem like her she hasn't become so mean and tough to not even talk normally to the kid.

ETA why didn't they shoot Aidan to at least prevent the suffering ?

dionneshea wrote:I'm unclear of what they're going for in Carol's storyline. It's like they took her terrifying tactic from last week and made it into Funny Hijinks. Like, the kid isn't terrified of her threats, he just wants the cookies, isn't that funny! But no, not funny, because he's being abused by his father, and now she wants Rick to murder the father. I'm not saying that Pete doesn't need a good murdering, but I'm a little at sea with how they've brought about the whole thing. It seemed forced, for lack of a better word.

And Father Gabriel. The only reason why I wasn't totally concerned during that scene is that he's so CLEARLY gone off the deep end, I don't know if Deanna even takes him seriously. Which is as it should be.

Carol's interactions with the kid felt off to me, too. I don't know much about the psychology of abused kids, but would an angry ten year old whose dad is beating his mom (maybe?) latch onto a new adult who verbally and emotionally abused him last week? Maybe he would, I'm not sure. But in the words of Ron Burgundy, that escalated quickly! Two weeks ago, Pete was being a PorchDick (TM Talking Dead) to Rick, last week, he was a smiley maybe alcoholic at Deanna's party, now Carol and Rick are probably going to hatch a plan to kill him. Meh.

Also, Gabriel? Do you think Maggie forgot that you locked your church and left your congregation to be eaten by walkers? I'm sure he is going off the deep end, but I'm not sure there's an Alexandria Mental Hospital for him to go to.

Spoiler:

Re: Carol and the kid. I got the sense that the kid saw Carol as initially terrifying but then realized that if anyone could stand up to his dad, it would be her. And for Carol, I think she is wary around children and has lost her ability to relate to them. She lost Sophia and has hardened her heart against feeling nurturing, a toughening that was further exacerbated by what happened to the girls, and what she had to do to Lizzie. And then all of sudden she realizes this little kid is not unlike who Sophia was/would have been and I think her humanity started to return. Of course then she got right back on the murderation train, but still.

Not shooting Aiden was unthinkably cruel. There was no way he'd survive those injuries in any case, even if there hadn't been any walkers.

Noah's death was indeed AWFUL - I actually had my first Walking Dead related nightmare after watching. And that was with my hand over my eyes. I thought it was a good death, though, as compared to Beth's (a much more established character) random end. I think that Glen being there as the witness made it worse. As they said on Talking Dead, Glen hasn't really been "in charge" when they lost someone and he missed out on, say, the Governor's killing Hershel.

The abused kid reaching out to Carol indeed makes questionable sense, since she was monstrous to him. I think they're actually pulling her back from the brink by giving her a reason to kill Porch Dick, when she'd probably do so 'just because'. But if he's abusive, it's not as crazy .

I think Gabriel, Sasha, and Carol are all cracked. Gabriel may be protecting himself from discovery re: letting his flock be slaughtered, but I think it's more along the lines of he's gone a little nuts AND he witnessed Rick's group murder the Termites without personally seeing what Terminus was like. So he really does think they're dangerous and he's too cracked to realize they've still saved his useless ass.

I'm liking this half of the season much more than last. I hope they don't explode Alexandria in the finale. It'd be nice for them to stay there longer than half a season...that said I still bet they blow it up before they leave. CDC...Farm...Prison....Terminus, they blow everything eventually.

I AM SO FUCKING TRAUMATIZED Y'ALL.

Sorry for the f-bomb, but it's warranted. Noah's death was gruesome and horrifying and probably the worst thing this show has depicted. All the worse for me because I liked Noah a lot as part of Beth's story and was looking forward to see how he'd fit into the family dynamics. But no. And now Glen is going to be a mess. Maybe the last fundamentally decent member of the core group, and he's now just going to be totally screwed up. Ah, Walking Dead, what have you done??

I think they got shock value from this but lost some good mileage in storytelling they could've gained in Noah.

Off to have another good cry...

Oh, Rick... Why so crazy? As I said before, I'm not saying that Pete doesn't need to be dead, but honestly, I think Deanna's method is better. Throw him out - I don't think he'd last that long. Yes, Carol lasted, but she was a seasoned survivor. You toss him out with only a knife and a can of food, he'll probably be dead in a day or so. And him coming back with a group - well, that's the price of not completely becoming a fascist dictatorship.

Glenn is my boo. I love everything they're doing with him in the back half of this season. If they harm a hair on his head, I will riot. Forget Daryl (I love Daryl, but I could way more easily lose him than Glenn). And I'm worried they are going to harm a hair on his head, because Nicholas has a gun and Glenn has pissed him off.

The Carl/Enid stuff was sweet, but I have the least interest in Carl when it comes to story lines. Like, it's nice to check in on him, but what the hell has Maggie been up to this season. We finally checked in on Rosita, but I'm way more interested in what's going on with Abraham and the descent into madness of Father Gabriel than in Carl running around with the new girl.

Speaking of Rosita, I loved her scenes with Michonne and Sasha. Those were great, and it was nice for them to recognize just how damaged Sasha is, but not know how to help her. Because she desperately needs help, but the only people I think who really could would be Bob and Ty and that's not an option. Maybe Maggie, because those two got close last season, but first Maggie would have to make an appearance on the show.

And ending with Daryl and Aaron, because they're great, but those bodies are totally creepy, and I don't like whoever is making the 'W's. I also totally expected that walker tied to the tree to try and take a chomp out of one of them.

I'm glad they have a 90 minute episode next week, because it seems like too much story to wrap up in addition to kicking off whatever's going to happen next season.

I posted but then the site was down so here goes - I totally understand crazy Rick things change you and what he has gone through does not allow him to let his guard down . If something happens to Glenn it better not be by Nicholas as that would be awful.

The penultimate episode of Walking Dead season 5 has got me feeling things all over the place. I'm annoyed, I'm worried, I'm intrigued, I'm confused.

I know this is a show with an enormous cast of characters (a la Lost) and sometimes it can be hard finding a place for everybody in every episode. But to not even see Tara and/or Eugene after last week's trauma is one of the more confusing decisions the writers have made recently. They could have spent two seconds showing up that she would be OK instead of having other characters tell us. And HOW is she going to be OK, exactly? That head wound was pretty gnarly.

On the other side, however, I was OK with not seeing Abraham or Maggie. I liked Rosita talking Michonne and both of them going after Sasha. It makes sense that Rosita would try to connect with them because they're women of a similar age and constantly being only with Abraham and Eugene must get pretty old. I loved Glenn and Rick's conversation (even if it was about something terribly sad) because they haven't talked like that in so long. Sometimes it's easy to forget that they have literally been together since the beginning, with Glenn (or his voice) appearing in the pilot.

I appreciate that in the past, this show has not gone overboard with sexual violence, and has used it in realistic, not exploitative ways. However, the scene of the naked walker tied to the tree is one of the most disturbing images from the show that I can remember, and it will stay with me for a long time. It disgusts me that there's no way they could show a naked woman on The Walking Dead, but for the fact that her guts were spilling out and her genitals were covered by that. Is that supposed to tell us that the "W" gang are bad guys? The truck full of torsos clued us into that way back in the mid-season premiere.

The least crazy person is...Daryl?

I am curious if this is what happened in the comic (so quickly), because it doesn't seem like they've been in Alexandria long enough for Rick to start being all "Execute Who I Say"...but then again he's a little nuts.

They're doing such a good job making everyone crazy, it's hard to judge what a reasonable reaction is. I do wonder if Carol asking Rick to kill Wifebeater is her going "last time I took shit into my own hands, you exiled me."

I love getting more of Glenn. Even traumatized Glenn brings a different vibe than everyone else and I loved his confrontation with Nicholas.

Nothing ? Morgan? Wolves? Something?

Did it sound mumbly to anyone else? I had to rewind at least three different scenes to hear the dialogue again.

Morgan! I enjoy him so much, and I'm glad he's finally with the group. The scene with him and the Wolf in the beginning was awesome and sort of reminded me of Tyreese and Martin talking way back in the season premiere. I enjoyed his Jedi skills with that stick and his (slightly crazy?) laugh when he said "Life is precious!" to Daryl. I figured he would appear as some kind of deus ex machina, but I didn't mind.

Daryl offering to go out so Aaron could escape paralleled (probably in his head) what Merle did, with sacrificing himself "for the good of the group". He and Aaron really are an odd couple from hell, because Aaron is as clean cut as the other Alexandrians, but his status as an "outsider" lets him connect with Daryl in a really great way. I want them to continue to work together next season.

My favorite line of the whole night was Carol's: "These are children. And children like stories". Not the way you tell them, girl!
I LOVED the scene with her and Pete. It felt like she was taking every ounce of shame and anger that she ever had at her husband and was calmly laying it out on Pete. It was probably her last dig ("And I want my dish back clean when you're done") that pushed him over the edge.

I wish I hadn't gone back and looked up the parallel storylines in the comics before the finale. I read them a long time ago, so I forgot how this thing with Pete ended. When it happened, I was just sort of meh about it.

I loved Carol saying that. I'm just confused if Morgan is going to be weird with Rick because of Pete.

Why did no one tell the Alexandrians the truth about Gabriel? I'm glad Eugene and Abraham made up.

I could probably do a masters thesis on the numerous ways I felt this season both worked and absolutely didn't, and maybe I'll do a longer post later on some of it. For now...

My heart was in my throat with the Glenn storyline. He's my breaking point. He's who I'm still watching for. If things don't improve storytelling-wise, and they kill him off, I'm done. And it looked like it might be going that way last night, and I was almost kind of relieved. Like, oh good, I can be done now. I am glad that he's still alive and that he didn't go over to the dark side.

I finally got behind what they were doing with Sasha. I'm also glad she didn't murder Father Gabriel. He's awful, but that would have sent Sasha over the edge, and I still love her. However, Father Gabriel is the actual worst. Leaving the gate open? What is wrong with him? He can't even try to kill himself without doing it like a huge jackass.

I hate who they've made Carol. Melissa McBride is still giving it her all, but she's so cartoony now. And I get lying to the Alexandrians, but lying to their own people? I feel the writers struggling the most with her character. With some it feels like they just couldn't care less (Maggie, Rosita), but with Carol it feels like they're trying, but don't know where they're going, so they just keep ramping her up. But it feels like it left realistic a ways back. Around one-woman assaualt on Terminus.

Contrast and compare to Rick who is also majorly over the top in places but who they manage to bring back down to a human place. His scene with Michonne was my second favorite in the episode.

My favorite scene was Daryl and Aaron in the car. Those two play off of each other so well. I was kind of disappointed in the Morgan ex Machina, but I can let it go. Though it did make me realise that I'm okay with Daryl dying. But his character has developed beautifully and I'd almost like him to go before they ruin it.

That final moment where Rick and Morgan see each other was fascinating. Last time they saw each other Morgan was dangerous and crazy and now he is achieved this Zen calm that lets him walk through the world with only a stick. Now you have Rick who is looking like a crazy mess covered in bandages and zombie blood and has just shot a restrained man in the head (albeit at Deanna's request). I thought it created an interesting mirror for how far down characters go but can then come back up.

I actually screamed "you had one job Father Gabriel!" when he didn't close the gate. Also, when the one guy was asking him for spiritual counseling and he was standing there all wild-eyed all I could think was "maybe seek solace from someone besides Father McCrazypants, dude."

Aaron has managed to make me interested in Daryl in a way that neither Beth nor Carol ever could. So I really hope that's developed further and Aaron gets to stick around for a while.

I was pretty much at the end of my rope with Rick after the last episode. I really don't think they sold him sinking to THAT level of madness. I don't dislike Jessie, but I can't deny the chorus of "Her?" that was going through my head the entire time he was losing his mind.

But the scene with Michonne mostly brought me back. "I thought you'd talk me out of it. You could've." Ugh, this is why I love them together.

With some it feels like they just couldn't care less (Maggie, Rosita), but with Carol it feels like they're trying, but don't know where they're going, so they just keep ramping her up. But it feels like it left realistic a ways back. Around one-woman assaualt on Terminus.

I'm right there with you on this one.