Downton Abbey (British version)

I loved the conversation Edith had with the Dowager Countess about finding something to do with herself. I loved that Edith went and wrote that letter saying, "HEY, a good portion of ladies can't vote... you dicks." (but in a more civil manner) SEE, Edith's knack for writing letters can be used for good.

Hee. Indeed. I was glad Matthew and Branson seemed impressed with her. Robert being all outraged... It's realistic that he wouldn't want the family names to be paraded around, but you just saved one of your daughters from maybe going to prison and you had one who was almost outed for having a dead man in her bed, there are worst things that your daughter writing a letter in the newspaper!

The Bates/Anna storyline was less tedious than usual. Same with Ethel. That storyline seemed to drag at some point last season, but this was interesting, if sad to watch.

The new footman storyline was funny. I loved that Mary sided with making the maids happy with the hire. It was nice to see Mary and Matthew back on better terms. I think they're going down the "Mary cannot get pregnant" storyline, which I thought might happen. Could be interesting.

I can't even wait until the credits finish running before coming here to vent. Fuck you, Julian Fellowes! First you have Edith dumped at the altar and now you kill Sybil. What the hell will you do to Mary in coming weeks?

On the other hand, if you want to drop an anvil on Robert's increasingly obnoxious head, I might just cheer.

JESUS FUCK CHRIST WHAT IN THE NAME OF ALL THAT IS HOLY WAS THAT?
I... Julian Fellowes, do you HATE the world?

I...may have a stroke.

I hope Tom gets to punch Branson. He and Cora were the ONLY ones who questioned his SHES ONLY 24 decision.

Kiran wrote:I hope Tom gets to punch Branson. He and Cora were the ONLY ones who questioned his SHES ONLY 24 decision.

So you want poor Tom Branson to punch himself now?? Has the man not been through enough already without having to injure himself too??!! Oh, the humanity!

Lol, I meant Robert.

THAT WAS NOT OK.

For once I'm glad I was spoiled, because it gave me time to accept it, and now I can just sit back and watch the fandom implode. Although I must say, Fellowes did make it as harrowing as possible. Poor Tom and Cora. I do love that Clarkson was actually right for the first time in his life but no one listened.

Honestly Sybil was kind of a nothing character at this point (and she was my fave in S1), so I'm kind of okay with her death (more drama!). However, if Mary can't have children, you can be sure I will be cursing Fellowes from now until eternity.

Oh, dear. That was just so depressing and awful to watch. I just knew something bad was going to happen when Sybil did her little monologue to her mother before going to sleep. Robert is the king of stupid decisions.

WHAT.

Looks like shit goes downhill for Lord of the house. As it should. He's pretty much a failure at life. He's needed Downton saved twice from the auction block, been partly responsible for killing his youngest daughter, and had an emotional affair with a maid.

And now it looks like he's going to be a child about having the baby baptized Catholic. I'm not religious, so I have a hard time empathizing with this sort of thing anyway, but he's not the baby's father. He has no say. Too bad, so sad.

Also Sybil told Mary she wanted the child baptized Catholic because she didn't care and it'd make Tom happy.

I have fears he is going to try to the kidnap the child tbh.

I do love that Clarkson was actually right for the first time in his life but no one listened.

I think viewers would have wanted Dr. Clarkson dead had he misdiagnosed yet another Downton situation (approaching Dr. Spaceman level of incompetence) so Fellowes wisely chose an outsider for that task!

WHAT. I spent all the time right up to her actual death saying 'well, they wouldn't actually kill Sybil. I mean I know it looks like it, but that's surely just a fake-out...' But when she started asking her mother to make her promises I knew she was doomed.

Robert really is useless. I don't understand what Mary's problem is either. Just last episode she was in fits of entitled petulance because it was looking like Downton was going to have to be sold due to her father's financial incompetence. Now she's getting upset about anybody insinuating that maybe somebody else should be looking after the business side of things.

YES and the fact that considering the dump has had to be saved TWICE, might indicate that maybe... just maybe... they should be doing things a little bit differently. And maybe it's my own feelings here but Mary, when you marry, you are a team and while you may disagree with your husband, but don't play this ridiculous game of switching loyalties.

Well, that was just plain awful to watch. I couldn't stand poor Cora having her last talk with her baby. I really thought they would go with the drama of having Branson and Sybil clash over raising the baby, not just kill Sybil off. I also think that Robert is going to try to baby-nap that kid. He's been displaying the worst entitlement issues lately, he probably think he owns the baby too.

The Bates storyline is such a snooze that I can't even remember what happened with him. I think my eyes glazed over and I took a little nap.

Robert needs to get punched in the head like, yesterday. And then! In the previews, he has the gall to throw his weight around about the baptism. Dude, you just killed your daughter. Go sit in a corner and don't say anything for a while.

It's interesting to me how my allegiances have switched since the first season. At the end of season 1, I hated Thomas, loved Bates, thought Edith was a brat and Robert was old fashioned but basically decent.

Now all I want from the show is for Thomas to get a boyfriend, Edith to find happiness and independence, and Robert to get a good slap. And the only thing that would redeem Bates' storyline is if he turns out to have done it.

Lily Rose wrote:I couldn't stand poor Cora having her last talk with her baby.

That was some great acting by Elizabeth McGovern. I was weepy.

Does the Sybil thing fit the recent blind item about a character killed offscreen that wasn't that unexpected, but would really upset the fans?

But she was killed on screen!

I teared up when Cora said goodbye, and the sisters too. I thought it was interesting that Granny called it the worst thing that had happened to them - surely there's been maternal death in the family before? I guess not in recent generations.

I work in maternal health, so I was trying to figure out what exactly the show was trying to say (if anything) about proper care during childbirth and maternal death. I don't agree with all of it, but it's interesting (to me anyway) to see:

- maternal death due to complications can happen to women who are otherwise perfectly healthy
- give birth in a hospital, or at least get thee to a hospital as soon as there's any problem
- if there's any chance of a complication, do a c-section
- even if you're having a complication which causes severe agitation and convulsions, you'll have time and presence of mind to say meaningful things to your loved ones
- per Granny, it's nobody's fault. Which I agree with in the larger scheme of things, but it IS the fault of the snooty doctor for ignoring the symptoms even with another doctor there pointing them out. I'm not sure of the state of evidence-based medicine at that point, so maybe eclampsia was only a theory at that point, but I didn't get that impression. It's not really Robert's fault unless we want to blame him for being a snob and going with the more prestigious doctor, but I honestly think most people would have at least been torn, and back in times with c-sections were much dodgier affairs, it would be a tough call to make. However, saying that Sybil's husband had less say than he did about the medical treatment because he was paying was massive asshattery. And I don't blame Cora for wanting him out of the bed for a while!


It's interesting that DA, like ER before them, choose eclampsia rather than hemorrhage. Hemorrhage is a much more common cause of maternal mortality, even today a significant percentage of women who suffer it have no risk factors beforehand, and one could argue about the best treatment (especially in those days).

I'm not amused to see that Robert is arguing about the baptism. You'd think that Sybil's death would give him a little perspective - but maybe it just adds to the long list of things that show he has little control over Downton anymore.

I think it wasn't so much maternal death but that it happened to Sybil. Sybil was always presented as the most decent of the Crawleys. The one everyone adored. So to have her die in such a horrible horrible painful way at age 24 right after giving birth really probably was the most horrible thing to happen to them all.

I think that's true; I think as silly as this show gets, the characters' relationships are well-enough established at this point that all of the grief felt earned. So often mourning on TV shows doesn't ring true for me, if they haven't completely sold the relationships the characters had up until that point. In this case, Sybil had already been established as a really sweet, kind young women that was good to everyone. It did make sense to me that even Thomas would be broken up about it; they did seem to work well together.

Ah, good point Kiran, I got too stuck thinking about the medical aspect: she was certainly the least-flawed of the sisters. I guess that's the point the writers were trying to make by having even jaded Thomas cry, as Decca notes. But at least she died before all the crap that it looks like her dad is going to put her husband through. Robert had better watch out or he might lose Cora.

As for the medical stuff, tbh I think it was more the new ways clashing with the old, which has been a theme all season (Branson in general, McClaine vs Smith). Hence the fears over the hospital. And also more then anything else a way to point out what an ass Robert is. I think it was more about him refusing to get out of the mindset of impressing Sir Francis, rather then anything about the medical field. I also think that is why eclampsia was chosen to. To be blunt its a more dramatic death then any other when it comes to birth. So to watch it on tv the impact is more horrifying in a way, though its much rarer.