This Business of Show

The thing I don't get is: Why Up All Night? Why all this effort and executive pot-stirring? Why try so desperately to make it a hit? Especially when they've treated so many of their other shows so shabbily. I understand the Maya Rudolph angle, but that only seems to explain only a small part of why they're trying so hard to make this particular show happen.

I have always assumed its because Lorne Michaels has pictures of top NBC execs doing unseemly things and he wanted it to work.

biakbiak wrote:I have always assumed its because Lorne Michaels has pictures of top NBC execs doing unseemly things and he wanted it to work.

This, the stellar cast (both talent and name recognition), and also the fact that NBC's current show developer people seem to be completely unfamiliar with the concepts of comedy, sitcoms, and how to make television people will watch.

I can see how it would be a morale booster if they managed to keep Arnett, Applegate, and Rudolph's show alive. And the opposite, how harmful the fact that they can't keep a show with a very talented and appealing cast, because the network apparently has absolutely no idea what it is doing.

I think when it started it was also a critically hit that performed mildly well. But they wanted it to be bigger than it was. So to do that...they totally fucked over what critics liked about it?

It was also one of the first deals really put together at NBC by Bob Greenblatt when he took over so it had a strong connection to someone at the top. Who really wanted a big hit to be his idea.

Hey, remember when NBC kept the underperforming Cheers and the only mildly successful Seinfeld around without messing with the formulas because they wanted to see these shows build an audience?

Because they don't.

Friends took some time to build its audience too. It didn't become a watercooler show until the second season.

The ER pilot was one of the highest scoring but the show itself didn't get OMG until Loves Labours Lost.

Barbara Walters to retire from broadcasting in May of 2014. With Joy leaving and the rumors about Elizabeth, I wonder if they will completely revamp The View.

And it's official:

Jimmy Fallon to take over Tonight Show from Jay Leno in February 2014.

Seriously not the career path I would have expected for Fallon when I saw him corpsing his way through nearly every SNL sketch, but good for him.

The "aura" of having the hosting job of The Tonight Show died with Johnny Carson, I think. Now, it's just another late night show. (But a part of me is hoping Letterman is getting a good cackle out of this.)

maxell131313 wrote:The "aura" of having the hosting job of The Tonight Show died with Johnny Carson, I think. Now, it's just another late night show. (But a part of me is hoping Letterman is getting a good cackle out of this.)

Conan must be rolling his eyes right now.

It's true that Tonight doesn't have the same aura that it did during the Carson years, but it's still the top-rated late-night talk show in an increasingly crowded field, and a go-to platform for A-listers in entertainment, the news media, and politics. This means that whoever gets into that time slot is going to have a major career boost, and an enormous amount of personal influence in the industry. And that's not even considering the horrifying missteps that NBC has made with casting the show, which means that it's an interesting story simply for the continued entertainment value.

As an Angeleno, I hate to say it, but moving the show back to New York is a smart move. That means that he'll still have Lorne Michaels and all of his contacts and influence backing him up, which Conan didn't have after his move to Los Angeles. Interestingly, it also means that Michaels now owns the 11:30 p.m. real estate on NBC six nights out of the week (as he'll still be executive producer), which makes him an even bigger power player than he was previously. Expect whoever is hosting SNL that week to pop up on the Tonight Show at some point. The musical guest will also likely be available. Add to that the extended SNL family members of former cast, regular hosts, and buddies of Lorne, as well as the usual endless stream of people who need to plug something, and this show is going to have some serious star power on call on any given night.

Also, Fallon's been proving his chops as an interviewer. He doesn't have the bite of Letterman or the edginess of Kimmel, but his boyish enthusiasm is actually a better fit for that slot than it is for 12:30, as he's less likely to alienate Leno's old audience than Conan was with his eccentric, intentionally awkward brilliance. He's also a more likeable presence than Leno, but that nearly goes without saying.

Eris Rising wrote:
Also, Fallon's been proving his chops as an interviewer. He doesn't have the bite of Letterman or the edginess of Kimmel, but his boyish enthusiasm is actually a better fit for that slot than it is for 12:30, as he's less likely to alienate Leno's old audience than Conan was with his eccentric, intentionally awkward brilliance. He's also a more likeable presence than Leno, but that nearly goes without saying.

I dunno, I really think Fallon is going to alienate Leno's audience in the same way Conan did. Well, maybe not precisely the same, but similarly. What Fallon will have going for him is NOT having the 10pm Jay Leno show before him.

Binky wrote:

Eris Rising wrote:
Also, Fallon's been proving his chops as an interviewer. He doesn't have the bite of Letterman or the edginess of Kimmel, but his boyish enthusiasm is actually a better fit for that slot than it is for 12:30, as he's less likely to alienate Leno's old audience than Conan was with his eccentric, intentionally awkward brilliance. He's also a more likeable presence than Leno, but that nearly goes without saying.

I dunno, I really think Fallon is going to alienate Leno's audience in the same way Conan did. Well, maybe not precisely the same, but similarly. What Fallon will have going for him is NOT having the 10pm Jay Leno show before him.

There will be a number of Metamucil-swigging "Leno or no show" types, but I think that Fallon will be less off-putting for the older crowd than Conan was, meaning that he'll have a better chance of maintaining some of the audience. And you're right about not having to deal with Leno cutting a swath of devastation through the 10 p.m. hour. I believe that for the rest of my life, that will be looked at as one of the single worst decisions ever made by a major television network.

Eris Rising wrote:
There will be a number of Metamucil-swigging "Leno or no show" types, but I think that Fallon will be less off-putting for the older crowd than Conan was, meaning that he'll have a better chance of maintaining some of the audience. And you're right about not having to deal with Leno cutting a swath of devastation through the 10 p.m. hour. I believe that for the rest of my life, that will be looked at as one of the single worst decisions ever made by a major television network.

I think you're right that Fallon is a little less weird/potentially offputting than Conan, but I am curious to see just how much of Leno's audience flees (not that I think they'll flee to Letterman, just that they might stop watching period). I guess I expect NBC to have a really awkward post-Leno period and I am kind of gleeful in hoping it sucks hard for them after the CoCo shenanigans. Like all that ridiculousness just to go through the exact same thing a few years later. And a thousand times yes to "single worst decision".

Eris Rising wrote:There will be a number of Metamucil-swigging "Leno or no show" types, but I think that Fallon will be less off-putting for the older crowd than Conan was, meaning that he'll have a better chance of maintaining some of the audience. And you're right about not having to deal with Leno cutting a swath of devastation through the 10 p.m. hour. I believe that for the rest of my life, that will be looked at as one of the single worst decisions ever made by a major television network.

If NBC had just let Leno walk in 2009, ABC was offering to move Kimmel and have him at 11:35. If he'd taken the offer, he would have just cut into Conan's Tonight Show audience that way. But it wouldn't have eaten into NBC's primetime programming like Leno at 10 p.m. did, and the network's sitcom/drama slate would now likely be in slightly better shape (but I don't know, it's NBC, they probably would have found a different banana peel to slip on). I also think Fallon won't repel nearly as many Tonight Show viewers as Conan did.

My disdain for NBC is warring with my affection for Fallon when it comes to whether I want to see this succeed or fail.

I get the upset at NBC, but my affection for Fallon is winning in this case, so I want him to succeed. Plus it's the Roots as the house band. How awesome is that?

Cutebutpsycho wrote:I get the upset at NBC, but my affection for Fallon is winning in this case, so I want him to succeed. Plus it's the Roots as the house band. How awesome is that?

You're right. Roots as the house band tips me over to hoping this works for him. Besides, I don't watch Letterman despite my sympathy for him, and Kimmel's inconsistent at best (though I've mentioned before that he seems to have the loose, fun interview style down better than anyone since Carson).

While I enjoy Coco and Kimmel's skits are kind of fun, my personal faves have been Craig Ferguson and Fallon.

Ferguson because he's all "Yep. We're cheap and on late. Want to see puppets and me geek out?" and Fallon because of his skits also. The Roots definitely help tip it over because they can also help with the skits (Black Simon and Garfunkel is win).

But that's just a personal taste thing.

The Roots are by far the best part of Fallon's show for me. Not that the rest of his show is bad, but I'll tune in sometimes just to see them, which I can't say for any other late-night show.

Cutebutpsycho wrote:While I enjoy Coco and Kimmel's skits are kind of fun, my personal faves have been Craig Ferguson and Fallon.

Ferguson because he's all "Yep. We're cheap and on late. Want to see puppets and me geek out?" and Fallon because of his skits also. The Roots definitely help tip it over because they can also help with the skits (Black Simon and Garfunkel is win).

But that's just a personal taste thing.

The fact that Ferguson honestly seems to not want the Letterman slot once it opens gives his show a free, anarchic quality that I haven't seen since Conan first brought on the Masturbating Bear.

I love Fallon. I actually enjoy all the non talk show hosts besides Leno? My loyalty is probably most to Conan because he was the first talk show host I really adored but they all have their strengths, and I generally will watch depending on what guest they have. I am weirdly gleeful for Letterman. I hope hes laughing somewhere about this, hes earned it.

I think Ferguson also knows that replacing Letterman will be a tougher job than replacing Leno. I know hes divisive but I've always loved Letterman because hes kind of no bullshit. If you are stupid, he won't pander to you (I fear for Lohan this week). I don't think hes cuddly, and that has hurt him as far as audience, but I also think hes the biggest inspiration for the current younger talk show hosts (particularly Kimmel) and that is a hard act to follow.

I love Ferguson though. Aside from the kinda crazy nature of his show, I think hes just a genuinely great interviewer.

I think Fallon will do well though. Hes not a panderer like Leno, but his humor is very warm and cozy in a way? Hes gentle and likable.

I personally think NBC is a shit show for lots of reasons, but frankly I'm totally team NBC in this regard. Normally I'm all for people being able to mock their network, but if there is anyone who should be eternally grateful for NBC its Jay Leno, since God knows over the last two decades they have fucked over a lot of talented, hard working people to ensure that Leno gets to add a new car to the garage every six months.

I love Ferguson though. Aside from the kinda crazy nature of his show, I think hes just a genuinely great interviewer.

I don't stay up late enough to watch any of the late night hosts that much, but I LOVE watching Craig Ferguson's interviews on Youtube. He seems so genuinely entertained by talking to people, it can't help but bring out the best in whoever he's interviewing (well, at least in the interviews I've seen, which may well have been the better ones.)

I love his interviews. His one with Stephen Fry where it's just the two of them the whole time and no audience is a treat in the art of conversation.